From: blakes7-d-request@lysator.liu.se Subject: blakes7-d Digest V00 #95 X-Loop: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se X-Mailing-List: archive/volume00/95 Precedence: list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="----------------------------" To: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se Reply-To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se ------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain blakes7-d Digest Volume 00 : Issue 95 Today's Topics: Re: [B7L] Avon's skills and Blake knowing about them Re: [B7L] Re: Anna Re: [B7L] Avon's skills [B7L] Page's Bar next weekend? Re: [B7L] Avon's skills and Blake knowing about them [B7L] Vera Cruz - make sure you see this film Re: [B7L] REM lyrics Re: [B7L] REM lyrics [B7L] Avon drool [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny" [B7L] Re: Blakes Seven Action Figures [B7L] UnAmerican Activities Re: [B7L] UnAmerican Activities Re: [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny" Re [B7L] The bank fraud Re: [B7L] What do we want from Horizon? Re [B7L] Anna GRANT? Re: [B7L] Page's Bar next weekend? Re: [B7L] Page's Bar next weekend? Re: [B7L] Vera Cruz - make sure you see this film Re: [B7L] B7 Fan Fiction Re: [B7L] REM lyrics Re: [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny" Re: [B7L] Avon's skills and Blake knowing about them Re: Re [B7L] The bank fraud [B7L] psudonyms [B7L] Ring finger (was Re: Horizon discussion) [B7L] Vila's taste in women Re: [B7L] Offers of marriage [B7L] Re: Time Squad - A Cally Perspective (long) [B7L] Re: Anna's Name Re: [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 11:08:32 +0200 From: "Marian de Haan" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Avon's skills and Blake knowing about them Message-ID: <009201bf9c83$09dd2540$d6ee72c3@marian-de-haan.multiweb.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Andrew Ellis wrote: >There is more to military service than being a squadie / space corp trooper. >There are numerous admin functions, scientific units etc etc. > >And, when push comes to shove. Avon takes orders from Blake when Blake >actually issues them. He may protest, but he carries them out. But Blake never requires a salute from him :-) >When you have >an asset as skilful as Avon, you don't worry about the odd bit of >insubordination, provided the job gets done. > >So, for Avon to function in the military, he just needs a commanding officer >who understands him, and to not be on the front line. Absolutely (especially that last condition)! Now this reminds me of Carnell's remark in Weapon: "The Officer Corps will forgive anything it can understand, which makes intelligence about the only sin." Does not look very promising for a man like Avon, does it? :-) Marian ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 11:23:29 +0200 From: "Marian de Haan" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: Anna Message-ID: <00a301bf9c85$1d773bc0$d6ee72c3@marian-de-haan.multiweb.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ellynne G. wrote: >What's slowly driving me nuts is trying to >figure out how much of the real Anna he knew. Did he fall for an >illusion or the real person? And _why_ did he fall for her? What >attracted him and made her the love of his life? I think the real tragedy for Avon was that she was presumed dead when his infatuation for her was at its highest. Had their relationship been given the time to go on I think it likely he would have got tired of her very quickly once his hormones had settled down. :-) Marian (frantically trying to remember where she put that chain mail...) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 01:45:21 -0800 From: mistral@ptinet.net To: B7 List Subject: Re: [B7L] Avon's skills Message-ID: <38E716B0.49CDF672@ptinet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Additional thought: > PatPat wrote: > > > It is interesting to note that Anna Grant actually achieved this > > 'military coup' objective (well, almost). Perhaps she managed to get > > away with the lion's share of the embezzlement, and left Avon holding > > the bag. > > Ack! What a neat twist! I can see Anna doing this, if I could > just square it with her dying declaration of love... What if Anna didn't realise that she loved Avon until after she'd taken the money? Maybe even after she'd seen him the last time? And she had him captured and shipped away to cover her tracks, but once he's gone she's sorry, but it's too late. This could explain why she acts so contradictorily in Rumors. Ooh. Like it :-D Mistral -- "Consider it an adventure."--Galen, 'Crusade' ------------------------------ Date: 02 Apr 2000 12:00:45 +0200 From: Calle Dybedahl To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Page's Bar next weekend? Message-ID: <86bt3s4yb6.fsf@tezcatlipoca.algonet.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii So, will there be anything? I'm leaving for London tomorrow, and I'm not sure if I'll have any mail access until I come home again. So I'd like to know really soon if the semi-planned Page's Bar event next weekend (Saturday, wasn't it?) will happen or not. And if it will happen, I want to know how to get to Page's Bar. -- Calle Dybedahl, Vasav. 82, S-177 52 Jaerfaella,SWEDEN | calle@lysator.liu.se "...a festering realization that all you do is no more than the futile slapping of paint onto the rotting, decayed infrastructure of the Information Superhighway." -- Jinx_tigr ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 03:01:27 PDT From: "Sally Manton" To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Avon's skills and Blake knowing about them Message-ID: <20000402100128.42590.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Andrew wrote: Love Avon as I do, I would baulk at calling it the *odd* bit of insubordination...Blake's Liberator runs on the decidedly unmilitary 'say what you like, then so what I say' principle. *Any* military-minded leader would have probably had him shot or dumped by episode 6 at the very least (and wouldn't we *love* to have seen Kasabi trying to deal with him and Vila?) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 11:15:19 +0100 From: "Alison Page" To: "lysator" , "freedom city" Subject: [B7L] Vera Cruz - make sure you see this film Message-ID: <000d01bf9c8c$73e4eb40$ca8edec2@pre-installedco> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A few years back I saw the last half hour of a film which I found extremely reminiscent of the Avon/Blake relationship. How frustrated I was that I hadn't seen the whole of it. The 'Avon' character was played by Burt Lancaster, and the Blake character by Gary Cooper. After watching it I learned that on the B7 set Paul Darrow was nicknamed 'Burt' because he was extremely fond of Mr L's morally ambiguous sensitive/macho acting style. (Who isn't?) And then to cap it all, at Deliverance, I heard Chris Boucher say that he drew a lot of his inspiration for B7 from the morally ambiguous westerns of the 50s. He mentioned just one film by name - yes it was 'Vera Cruz'. I can't tell you how strongly I recommend that you see this film. It is on today (Sunday) on BBC2, at 2.30. I hope the whole of it is as good as the small bit I saw a few years ago. But certainly worth seeing by anyone who is interested in the evolution of the Blake and Avon characters in the minds of the actors and scriptwriters. And, you will spot Servalan very easily :-) Alison ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 11:32:05 +0100 From: Nicola Collie To: Lysator Subject: Re: [B7L] REM lyrics Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Trish said: >How come no one suggested "Shiny Happy People?" > >Trish > Because the CD hadn't got that far yet? ;) Or (closer to the truth) I didn't want to bring the wrath of the TN down upon my head by making the first suggestion that came to mind... Nicola ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 04:11:13 PDT From: "Sally Manton" To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] REM lyrics Message-ID: <20000402111113.91143.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed After Trish asked: Nicola wrote < Or (closer to the truth) I didn't want to bring the wrath of the TN down upon my head by making the first suggestion that came to mind...> Not just me, then...? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 12:38:03 +0100 From: Julia Jones To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Cc: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Avon drool Message-ID: In message <20000402065010.22881.qmail@hotmail.com>, Sally Manton writes >Lesseee...oh, to be different, let's make it black.. Very tight leather >trousers, of course, with knee-length boots (hijackers in thigh-boots is a >little hard to swallow, though I don't mind trying) Must remember this isn't Freedom City... must... resist... temptation... > and a black silk shirt like >the one in Aftermath - or maybe white. Or cream. Or... You're just doing this to tease me, because you know I'm not up to extended typing at the moment... -- Julia Jones "Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!" The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 13:18:01 +0100 From: "Ariana" To: "b7" , "Judith Proctor" Subject: [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny" Message-ID: <010301bf9ca3$07078980$ace407c3@ariana> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Elementary, my dear Cally. I thought this was excellent. OK, so it's a bit of a Blake's 7/Agatha Christie crossover with Avon cast as Hercule Poirot, but on the whole, it worked very well. I was certainly in the dark as to whodunnit right to the final revelation. The numbers/letters thing was perhaps a bit pat, but it was certainly a surprise. On the other side of the plot, I wasn't so enthralled by the Liberator's race to Destiny. There were so many plot holes in that part of the story that the entire ship could have punched a path through them. See the nits section for more details. Fortunately, though, most of the focus was on the murder mystery on the Ortega. As I said, I thought this worked really well. The right amount of suspense and red herrings, and some good team work (!) between Avon and Cally. I would have been terribly disappointed if Avon had been the only one to find all the solutions. Cally's revelation about the homing beacon, for instance, just stopped the episode from being Avon Reveals All. But yes, on the whole, an excellent episode. Character stuff: ================ It's the Avon and Cally show. Mr Wonderful is transformed into Sherlock Holmes for an episode, and Cally actually gets to do some thinking and fighting. After the last couple of episodes, I was beginning to wonder what people saw in Cally. Now I see it. In this episode, she proves to be intelligent and resourceful, and another female who does not scream despite ample opportunity to do so. I think even I might have let out a peep in that stock room. But the screaming was left to Sara -- and was later revealed not to be the stereotypical reaction of another hysterical sci-fi female, but a clever ploy to make herself look innocent. It's always nice when a show does manage to avoid an obvious stereotype. As to Cally, her "I believe you" scene with Sonnheim was excellent, with just the right mix of slyness and coyness to make you wonder whether she did believe him or not. She obviously doesn't pay too much attention to Avon's biting remarks either -- I particularly loved the way she rolled her eyes when he complained about her volunteering them as hostages. I gather the general concensus on the Liberator by now is that Avon's bark is worse than his bite. Speaking of which, it was interesting to to see Avon do something else than twiddle knobs and snarl a lot. He still does plenty of both, but also gets to strut around with his hands behind his back, putting on a fine display of Holmesian superciliousness. It does add a bit more depth to the character, with the notion that he can be motivated by curiosity as well as greed and self-interest. I suppose that's part of the reason he's still on the Liberator and not living it up on some planet somewhere. Aside from this, Blake gets to do his noble bit, Vila shows off his general fecklessness, and Gan and Jenna are pretty much wallpaper. Nitpicks and Preposterous Props: ================================ I wonder why this episode kept going into fuzzyvision. Blake and Avon start off crisp and clear in a corridor, then they open a door and look as though they've been filmed on home video. Maybe the BBC spent its film budget on those shots of the Liberator in space -- which weren't too bad, IMHO. I do have a few nits about the Liberator's trip to Destiny. If it would take the Ortega five months to get back to Destiny at sub-light speed, doesn't that mean they should be pretty much in Destiny's solar system? Blake embarks on a mission to transport a crucial cargo to a planet, and he doesn't even check to see that it's still in the box before leaving? On its way to Destiny, the Liberator laboriously ploughs through an asteroid field, nearly depleting its power. Then Blake decides to go back. Next thing we know, the Liberator is back near the Ortega. Um, wouldn't the Liberator have had to laboriously plough through the asteroid field again just in order to go back? On the props side, it looked a bit as if the doors on the Ortega were made of cardboard or styrofoam -- but then this *is* Blake's 7 and I would expect no less. The interior decor was screaming Seventies modern; my grandmother had an awful lot of furniture that looked like that. But as the Seventies are in these days, I thought the Ortega's recreation room ended up looking rather stylish. Dialogue Gems: ============== KENDALL: [Putting neutrotope in the box] Yes, it's enough to tempt anyone. There are men who would betray their companions for a lot less. AVON: [Appearing in doorway] What a very cynical thought, Doctor. ====== CALLY: Remember that Avon and I will be staying. We will regard ourselves as hostages against Blake's return. AVON: Well thank you Cally, what a clever idea. CALLY: [telepathically] Blake will return. AVON: You can bet your life on it, in fact you've just bet both our lives on it. ====== CALLY: We must help these people. [She and Avon hand their teleport bracelets to Blake] AVON: Must we? Personally, I don't care if their whole planet turns into a mushroom. ====== CALLY: My people have a saying, a man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken. AVON: Life expectancy must be fairly short among your people. [[I wonder if Avon remembered Cally's saying three and a half years later...]] ====== VILA: [Entering with Blake] Where are Cally and Avon? BLAKE: It's a long story. VILA: Well what's in the box? BLAKE: It's an even longer story. VILA: I like stories! ====== CALLY: I agree. So who do you think it is? AVON: Mandrian. CALLY: Why? AVON: Instinct. I discount Dr. Kendall. CALLY: I thought you mistrusted instinct. AVON: I do, so I am probably wrong. ====== ZEN: In one point zero three minutes, it will no longer be possible to operate force wall and main drive simultaneously. Please decide which to close down. JENNA: Without main drive we'll never get out of this. VILA: Without the force wall we'll be smashed to pieces. [[Life is never simple on the Liberator]] ====== KENDALL: Five four one two four? AVON: Precisely. PASCO: What's it mean? AVON: Absolutely nothing. As a number it has no significance at all, but when I was in the filter plant just now, I noticed one of the instruments. Liquid crystals show a number, and then the confirmation circuit translates those numbers into the written word. Right from the start, we thought that those were numbers. They are not, they are letters. CALLY: Letters? AVON: Rafford was dying. It's difficult to be neat under those circumstances. [he takes a marker pen and paper and draws] Let's start with the one and the two... [The letters A R A appear] And the first letter... [He puts an S in front, everyone looks at SARA] [[Tada! Avon Reveals All (er, not to be misinterpreted by the Avon enthusiasts out there ;)]] ====== VILA: I don't think I feel very well. GAN: I hope nothing's been broken. [Retrieves box] BLAKE: So do I. [Opens box - empty] It's still on the Ortega. We've got to get back to them. VILA: Now I know I don't feel very well. [[But while you're at it, how about whacking Blake for not checking the contents of the box before he left?!]] ====== AVON: [after fighting with Sara] You'd better get her out of here, I really rather enjoyed that. [[Ah, so that's why he takes up the black leather later on...]] Miscellaneous: ============== Since comments about Avon's wardrobe seem de rigueur, can I just mention at this point that in this episode he looks as if he's wearing a sailor suit that's been dyed black? I know we've seen the outfit before, but it's only now that I've finally put my finger on what was bugging me about it. That and the computer switches on the front, of course. The Ortega crew seems to all have collars made out of that thick material you put under table cloths to protect your table. I'd certainly swear that their collars had the same pattern on them. JENNA: Zen says it's a Mark Three Galaxy Class cruiser. BLAKE: Galaxy Class? What, like the Enterprise-D? [[Well, you knew I wouldn't resist *that*]] Comments and discussion welcome! Ariana ====== "You'd better get her out of here, I really rather enjoyed that." -- Avon, after fighting Sara in "Mission to Destiny" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 14:00:53 +0100 From: "Ebony" To: "Lysator" Subject: [B7L] Re: Blakes Seven Action Figures Message-ID: <004801bf9cb7$0f8e5e80$44ad7dc2@default> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Trish wrote: >The Kerr (I don't really ever use a first name) Avon doll >Intermittant conscience optional Hee hee. Great line. >The Del Tarrant doll >A set of 64 oversized very white teeth rather than the normal 32 >Personality optional ROFL! >The Anna Grant doll >Just turn her head to see the multiple faces >To see the original Anna Grant, it is necessary to purchase the optional rose >colored glasses available as part of the Avon accessories. Thank you Trish, it's ages since my sides hurt from laughing so much! Ebony - who won't quote her real name on an archived list. If it matters, those on the Other List know who I am :-) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 11:28:31 -0400 From: "Dana Shilling" To: "b7" Subject: [B7L] UnAmerican Activities Message-ID: <000501bf9cb8$1c428420$e0614e0c@dshilling> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit One of the compelling qualities of B7 is its utter estrangement from the norms of American TV (and, as an American, I have far more exposure to the US than the British product). Although there have been U.S. series that have killed sympathetic characters, American shows find it necessary to _have_ sympathetic characters, and it would be considered rude to wipe out the entire cast. Although an American version of B7 would gain in some ways (American actors don't go to the pub, they go to the gym; Americans wait until they have enough money to produce a TV show before producing a TV show...) it would never be able to achieve the wonderfully disconcerting quality of the original. Paradigmatically, US shows are about a house and a family, and any initial conflict is resolved by incorporating the outsiders into the family. In a US series, Rumours of Death would be much earlier in the series, and would be the turning point for uniting the crew into a cohesive and affectionate unit. At the end of Children of Auron, everyone would be "sharing a laugh"--in the British product, note that Vila, Tarrant, and Dayna are sitting on one couch, eating popcorn or the functional equivalent. Avon is on the other couch. An American show would feel compelled to adopt the Blakean worldview: that not only is it worth fighting Federation tyranny, but that a scrappy little band of outsiders can achieve a decisive victory. In the American version, Anna would succeed at her coup d'etat, surrender power to Blake, and she and Avon would go off into the sunset (and he would be able to suppress any momentary tendencies toward Extreme Emotional Disturbance homicide). Or, again in light of Casablanca affinities, the politically unaffiliated anti-hero would opt for activism and "beautiful friendship" and abandon adulterous romance. The disconcerting thing about the "real" B7 is that, if anything, the show punishes Avon for excessive optimism. Instead of teaching Avon that trust and cohesion are essential, it affirms his perception that trusting Anna and Blake was a mistake and a weakness. In fact, it shows him that the consequences were even worse than he imagined. -(Y) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 08:07:00 -0700 From: mistral@ptinet.net To: B7 List Subject: Re: [B7L] UnAmerican Activities Message-ID: <38E76213.7D48B8B8@ptinet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dana Shilling wrote: > The disconcerting thing about the "real" B7 is that, if anything, the show > punishes Avon for excessive optimism. Yes. Great post all through, thank you, Dana. Mistral -- "Consider it an adventure."--Galen, 'Crusade' ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 18:09:22 +0100 From: "Una McCormack" To: "b7" Subject: Re: [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny" Message-ID: <045a01bf9cc6$d1af5690$0d01a8c0@codex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ariana wondered: > I wonder why this episode kept going into fuzzyvision. Blake and Avon start > off crisp and clear in a corridor, then they open a door and look as though > they've been filmed on home video. Maybe the BBC spent its film budget on > those shots of the Liberator in space -- which weren't too bad, IMHO. It's switching from video to film. Classic mark of 70s TV. Can't understand why those particular bits in the corridors are on film, as it's usually location work done on film. It could be something to do with filming/shooting schedules. Anyone? Una ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 02:44:04 +0100 From: "Neil Faulkner" To: "b7" Subject: Re [B7L] The bank fraud Message-ID: <000601bf9cca$e9236100$e535fea9@neilfaulkner> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Muddy Mildred, actually talking about the series again... Re the bank fraud and whether Avon or not was working for some unspecified third party. Spacefall has Vila citing a figure of 5 million credits, whereas the Ultra up that to 500 million. It's possible that the 5 million Vila referred to was Avon's pay-off, and it was the whopping great 500 mill figure that had the great Bartolomew assigned to him. A fraud on that scale would be something Central Security couldn't afford to ignore. Anyone who was relying on Avon to cook the books that much could probably arrange to get him safely out of the way when it was all over. Yet he had to arrange his own escape. So maybe he was duped over the sheer scale of the thing, and then got a bit miffed to discover that he was getting just a measly 1 per cent for himself and/or that he was being treated as an expendable pawn. Or maybe the man with the exit visas was the pre-arranged escape route, but Avon (rightly) suspected a double cross. I see him as playing just one, albeit crucial, role in an operation that involved a fair number of people. One of whom might have been Bartolomew, who had not been directly assigned to Avon but met him in the course of infiltrating the scam. Just who Avon was working for is an open question, though. Neil "I am not a man, I am a free number." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 03:13:13 +0100 From: "Neil Faulkner" To: "b7" Subject: Re: [B7L] What do we want from Horizon? Message-ID: <000801bf9cca$f2450680$e535fea9@neilfaulkner> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Judith wrote: > What I would like to see is the following: > > 1. Clear, public policy statements. Definitely. Furthermore, I would like to see policy determined by the consensus (or at least majority vote) of committee members who explicitly hold responsibility for determining club policy. I doubt if all matters of editorial policy could be decided beforehand. Obvious things like levels of profanity and explicitness of artwork could be agreed on (bearing in mind that the NLs are going to be read by some very young members), but there will always be a need to adapt and improvise on specific items of content. This should not be the province of just one person. > 2. Published annual accounts. (This is *not* meant to imply that I suspect any > dishonesty. It's simply that I'd like to have a better idea of how the club > functions.) Agreed. I have no grounds to suspect that Horizon have ever acted dishonestly with members' money. > 3. Elections. > If the members don't like Horizon's policies, then they should have the option > to vote in new committee members. If they support the policies then they should > be able to express this support. The only problem there is (a) getting people to stand and (b) getting members to vote. Kathryn last year pointed out, IIRC, that elections to club committees often turn out to be a formality, single candidates elected on a handful of votes. Nevertheless, the principle is important. > That's all I want. Bring in (1) and (3) and I'd certainly consider rejoining. Point (2) I'm not particularly bothered about. I trust them where my money's concerned. Neil "I am not a man, I am a free number." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 03:27:51 +0100 From: "Neil Faulkner" To: "b7" Subject: Re [B7L] Anna GRANT? Message-ID: <000901bf9cca$f3732640$e535fea9@neilfaulkner> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I know you all think I'm mad and deluded, but consider this: 'Sula' is not just any old name, it is the scientific name of a bird. Specifically, the Gannet. Think about it. Black and white. Eats fish. Long spikey beak. Webbed feet. Anna Grant? No, I fear not. She is Anna Gannet, she whose name is a byword for gluttony, a greed that knows no bounds and will engulf us all in its insatiable quest for the enslavement of all humankind. Here at last is the final proof, the last shred of damning evidence that What further warning do we need? Neil "I am not a man, I am a free number." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:02:19 +0100 From: "Una McCormack" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Page's Bar next weekend? Message-ID: <047401bf9ccd$a8e26020$0d01a8c0@codex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Calle: > So, will there be anything? I'm leaving for London tomorrow, and I'm > not sure if I'll have any mail access until I come home again. So I'd > like to know really soon if the semi-planned Page's Bar event next > weekend (Saturday, wasn't it?) will happen or not. And if it will > happen, I want to know how to get to Page's Bar. I'm definitely going to be there, and Carol and Teri are planning to be there as well. I'm not brilliant on London directions so someone leap in if I'm giving a really crap route. Pages is on Page St. Take the Victoria line on the tube to Pimlico, come out onto Rampayne St and turn right. You'll reach a big main road (Vauxhall Bridge Road); cross this and head directly down the road opposite (Regency Street). This bends away to the left. Page Street is about five minutes walk on the right, Pages Bar is a short walk, again on the right, on a corner. Someone please leap in if this is wrong: I once got lost in my home town (only lived there for 20 years) so I suffer from extreme anxiety when handing out directions. If all goes pear-shaped, Calle, I'll have my mobile with me: 07968 759319. Did we fix a time? I think Carol and Teri were planning to get there around 6:30 / 7pm. Una ------------------------------ Date: 02 Apr 2000 20:11:29 +0200 From: Calle Dybedahl To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Page's Bar next weekend? Message-ID: <86n1nc1ige.fsf@tezcatlipoca.algonet.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >>>>> "Una" == Una McCormack writes: > I'm definitely going to be there, and Carol and Teri are planning to be > there as well. Excellent. I'll try to get there, then. I got an off-list message from Rob Clother saying that he'll try to come too. I don't know if Harriet'll come, but it's not impossible that she might. > Did we fix a time? I think Carol and Teri were planning to get there > around 6:30 / 7pm. I'll aim for that, then. -- Calle Dybedahl, Vasav. 82, S-177 52 Jaerfaella,SWEDEN | calle@lysator.liu.se "Then I dream of a world where idiots are hunted like wild pigs" -- Stephen Edwards, scary.devil.monastery ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 16:41:10 +0100 From: "Ariana" To: "lysator" , "freedom city" Subject: Re: [B7L] Vera Cruz - make sure you see this film Message-ID: <00a401bf9cd3$ecfb7c00$b6e407c3@ariana> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Alison Page > A few years back I saw the last half hour of a film which I found extremely > reminiscent of the Avon/Blake relationship. Yep. It had been on about ten minutes and I could see exactly what you mean... :) Thanks for the head's up! > And, you will spot Servalan very easily :-) Ah yes. Now, who's up to writing some fic where Avon and Blake find themselves in the unenviable position of escorting *Servalan* somewhere? I must admit it had been a while since I watched a 50s movie. Having watched Vera Cruz, I kept to the same time period and switched over to watch Forbidden Planet. Boy did that movie ever terrify me the first time I saw it. It's still amazing now, with special effects that still stand the test of time. Despite a few obvious matte paintings, I'd even go so far as to say they hold up pretty well against say, "Farscape" and the new "Randall and Hopkirk (Deceased)", another couple of things I've watched this week-end... hmm, does that sound as if I've been watching way too much TV in the last 24 hours? I even threw in "Easy Rider" last night, for good measure! Ariana http://www.alpha.ndirect.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:59:11 +0100 From: "Una McCormack" To: "'B7 Lysator'" Subject: Re: [B7L] B7 Fan Fiction Message-ID: <04a301bf9cd5$90ad8040$0d01a8c0@codex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What do I like in fanfic? Louise summed the basic up pretty well: > I think it's safe to > say we all like well-written stories where the characters fit our own > personal idea of the characters. and went on: > I have read stories that the majority of > fandom raves about as "classics" that I just found dull because these > weren't _my_ characters. Yes, I've had that experience as well . That's half the fun of it really, I suppose, exploring different interpretations. Here are a few of my favourite things... 1. Avon and Blake arguing politics and morality. The whole point of B7 to me is the tension between idealism and pragmatism. OK, and the whole justifying rebellion debate as well. 2. Insights into the workings of the Federation, preferably those which muddy the waters a bit, making the rebels as bad as the enemy they fight. 3. Raindrops, roses, whiskers, penguins. 4. Loss, betrayal, angst, preferably Avon-flavoured. I like Anna as a character and I like exploring her motivations. 5. Not slash (in this fandom, at least) - again, as Louise summed up, for credibility reasons. 6. If we're going for a crew runaround type of story, season 2 bunch please. Una ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 20:28:48 +0100 From: "Una McCormack" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] REM lyrics Message-ID: <04c801bf9cd9$b25b7e00$0d01a8c0@codex> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Stretching this one a bit, but it's quite fourth season Vila (it's 'Sad Professor' off the last album): If we're talking about love then I have to tell you, dear readers, I'm not sure where I'm headed. I've got lost before. I've woke up stone drunk face down on the floor. Late afternoon, the house is hot. I started, I jumped up. Everyone hates a bore. Everybody hates a drunk. I hate where I wound up. I hate where I wound up. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 09:30:19 +0100 From: "Andrew Ellis" To: "b7" Subject: Re: [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny" Message-ID: <00da01bf9c84$fea36340$e46201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ariana Subject: [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny". More interesting reading. Going back to an old post...... >I was certainly in the dark as to whodunnit right to the >final revelation. The numbers/letters thing was perhaps a bit pat, but it >was certainly a surprise. Need I say more. >Nitpicks and Preposterous Props: >================================ >I do have a few nits about the Liberator's trip to Destiny. If it would take >the Ortega five months to get back to Destiny at sub-light speed, doesn't >that mean they should be pretty much in Destiny's solar system? Erm. Yes. >On its way to Destiny, the Liberator laboriously ploughs through an asteroid >field, nearly depleting its power. Then Blake decides to go back. Next thing >we know, the Liberator is back near the Ortega. Um, wouldn't the Liberator >have had to laboriously plough through the asteroid field again just in >order to go back? I always detect a certain smugness in Blake right at the very end. A, "bet you thought I couldn't do it" type of smugness. The only explanation I can think of, and it is weak weak weak - is that they went through once, and Zen noted the position and velocity of all of the meteorites. On the way back, Zen knew where they would all be, and plotted a course through, at standard by gosh, and sailed right through with no force wall. Not as silly as it sounds. If anybody else tried to program up their own version of Asteroids, and forgot to make the actual asteroids random, you could easily learn how to zip around the screen all day on just thrusters. Gnog. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 09:49:22 +0100 From: "Andrew Ellis" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Avon's skills and Blake knowing about them Message-ID: <00db01bf9c85$00363840$e46201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sally Manton > and wouldn't we *love* to have seen Kasabi trying to deal with him [Avon] and >Vila? Yes. Actually, the main problem would be that, in the series, Avon is coming into the relationship from a position of power, and might believe, as Blake's second in command, that he outranks her. So as the series played out, she wouldn't stand a chance. But consider an alternative, Kasabi intercepts the London and rescues the more able prisoners (say). She now potentially has a position of authority over both Blake and Avon (this is the assumption I want to start from, done;t matter how we get there). So the question is..... would she have the ability ? On the plus side, she has lead a rebel force on the home planet for a long time, comes across as a strong character. On the minus side, her team do seem, shall we say, intellectually challenged. She failed to bring a gifted cadet into line (Servalan), a task equal to bringing Avon into line. I don't know, could Kasabi have been able to lead Avon ? Gnog ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 10:11:08 +0100 From: "Andrew Ellis" To: "b7" Subject: Re: Re [B7L] The bank fraud Message-ID: <00dc01bf9c85$0290f120$e46201d5@leanet.futures.bt.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Neil Faulkner >Re the bank fraud and whether Avon or not was working for some unspecified >third party. Spacefall has Vila citing a figure of 5 million credits, >whereas the Ultra up that to 500 million. It's possible that the 5 million >Vila referred to was Avon's pay-off, and it was the whopping great 500 mill >figure that had the great Bartolomew assigned to him. A fraud on that scale >would be something Central Security couldn't afford to ignore. Good one. >I see him as playing just one, albeit crucial, role in an operation that >involved a fair number of people. One of whom might have been Bartolomew, >who had not been directly assigned to Avon but met him in the course of >infiltrating the scam. And so we come back to Bartholomew. And for me the key is still why she used her real name. Plot.... Perhaps (as inspired by another post which suggested the ending) she was actually behind the whole thing. She met Avon at college / academy and thought, he's good, I'll stay close to him. She works her way through the secret service, and becomes the latest incarnation of Bartholomew. She has access to everything, and can't be traced. She marries Chesku for political power but used one of her assumed names, but still stays close to Avon - he will be useful eventually. The plot for a military coup evolves. Everything is in place, but she needs mercenaries. She calls on Avon. Avon loves/trusts no one but Anna (he is mistaken !). The Fraud fails. To shift suspicion Bartholomew arranges for Anna to be recorded as dead. She realises she has grown to love Avon, nearly as much as power and so manages to get Avons death sentence commuted to transportation. Only Bartholomew's immediate commander knows (Servalan), and knows why. Servalan blackmails Anna into using Chesku to support her ambitions for Supreme Commander. 2 series of B7 pass. Anna re positions herself. She has some political power (through Chesku), some money (through Avon) and her position (as Bartholomew), and a great deal of resentment (for Servalan). THIS time, she obtains mercenaries by aligning with the revolutionaries, and but for Donald Douglas's portrayal of a loyal captain, nearly gets away with it. Then Avon returns to her life just before victory is snatched away from her, completing her total psychological defeat. Sevalan realises how she has obtained power from Anna and Avon, and takes great pleasure in repeating the feat in series 4, and Avon knows it. Well, there it is, probably conflicts with about 15 aspects of canon, which I am sure will be pointed out to me very quickly indeed. Gnog. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 21:02:54 -0800 From: Pat Patera To: B7 Lysator Subject: [B7L] psudonyms Message-ID: <38E6D47E.8BFBCB97@netzero.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Margaret wrote: >On psudonyms and real names and the like. I really don't think it matters unless >one is doing it to be anonymously nasty. If the B7 crew were on the lyst, and needed to hide their identity from the Federation snoops, what email pseuds would they take? Vila: Fingers Blake: Pinky Avon: The Brain Jenna: LadyHawke Cally: Psychic Hotline Dayna: Maid Marion Tarrant: FlyBoy Soolin: Annie Oakley Zen: Dali Llama Orac: Evil Overlord Slave: Spartacus PatPat (aka Puss'nBoots) -- "Never give up. Never surrender." -- Galaxy Quest _____________________________________________ NetZero - Defenders of the Free World Click here for FREE Internet Access and Email http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:18:14 -0400 From: Harriet Monkhouse <101637.2064@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:blakes7@lysator.liu.se" Subject: [B7L] Ring finger (was Re: Horizon discussion) Message-ID: <200004021918_MC2-9F7D-DFC6@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sally wrote: > but Russ, we can't stop now, > we've only done Avon's *left* ring finger... Have we done "Is Avon married, based on the evidence of said finger?" recently? Harriet ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 09:31:22 EST From: "J MacQueen" To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Vila's taste in women Message-ID: <20000402233122.58010.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >From: Helen Krummenacker > > >Vila, OTOH, is not that discriminating, is he? ;-) > > You have to ask? >More so than Tarrant, though. Never tried to have a go at Servalan. Hm. There are times when one wonders if Tarrant knows the meaning of fear. One also wonders if Soolin is fluffier than she looks, given Vila's interest in her. Servalan, however, is a seriously scary woman. Regards Joanne ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 09:34:56 EST From: "J MacQueen" To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Offers of marriage Message-ID: <20000402233456.44767.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >From: "Neil Faulkner" >Much as I hate to disappoint the pair of you, Ms Right in this pair of eyes >must be a fanatical atheist with rabid Marxist inclinations. Right, now I settle back to watch this. Should be interesting... Regards Joanne ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:18:05 -0400 From: Harriet Monkhouse <101637.2064@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:blakes7@lysator.liu.se" Subject: [B7L] Re: Time Squad - A Cally Perspective (long) Message-ID: <200004021918_MC2-9F7D-DFC1@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Russ wrote, in his extremely interesting Cally perspective: >Her last shot is in response to Jenna's comment as to the >wisdom of bringing aliens aboard. She shows no reaction. Oh, go on, she smirks broadly. I've got a lovely picture of it from Paul James's site. Harriet ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 19:55:59 -0400 From: "Dana Shilling" To: "b7" Subject: [B7L] Re: Anna's Name Message-ID: <000501bf9cff$00d955a0$d1614e0c@dshilling> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In Casablanca, Captain Renaud says that he knows that Rick can't return to the United States, and he likes to think that Rick "robbed a bank...or slept with a Senator's wife." We can think of someone who did both, n'est-ce pas? (Amazing prescience alert: Rick then looks at the dossier Major Strasser is holding and says "Are my eyes really brown?"--definitely not one of his better efforts. But it would make perfect sense for Avon to look down at his dossier and say, "Are my eyes really black?".) There are at least two reasons why the Federation would be so upset about a crummy five million credit hack. (In "Ultraworld," one of the Ultras refers to "five hundred million credits," and Avon refrains from correcting him. Emily Post would be glad.) For one thing, it's not a bank _fraud_ that's the problem, but _bank_ fraud. The Federation certainly doesn't want to give factory tours of the Mint and give out free samples to the citizenry. We have been furnished little information for materialist analysis, but I assume it was the Federation Central Bank, simply because I assume that the Federation owned everything. For another thing, the fastest way to get into trouble was getting a bureaucrat mad at you. Federation Civil Service probably had special Post-It Notes printed for attachment to dossiers, with a check-box for "He's stuffing my wife, so bury him." Anyway, the Federation would probably send you to a penal colony planet for life for unpaid parking tickets--if they were really angry, they'd do something _unpleasant_. -(Y) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Apr 2000 07:00:56 +0100 From: "Neil Faulkner" To: "b7" Subject: Re: [B7L] First impressions: "Mission to Destiny" Message-ID: <000701bf9d32$fd782ba0$e535fea9@neilfaulkner> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Una wondered > It's switching from video to film. Classic mark of 70s TV. Can't understand > why those particular bits in the corridors are on film, as it's usually > location work done on film. It could be something to do with > filming/shooting schedules. Anyone? I believe it's because they were filmed at Ealing (?) studios, where for some reason using tape wasn't possible. Wish they'd shot the whole bloody series on film, coz it looks *so* much better. Neil (typing one handed while he scoffs his muesli) "I am not a man, I am a free number." -------------------------------- End of blakes7-d Digest V00 Issue #95 *************************************