From: blakes7-d-request@lysator.liu.se Subject: blakes7-d Digest V99 #208 X-Loop: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se X-Mailing-List: archive/volume99/208 Precedence: list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="----------------------------" To: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se Reply-To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se ------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain blakes7-d Digest Volume 99 : Issue 208 Today's Topics: [B7L] Paul Darrow Interview Re: [B7L] Servalan [B7L] Servalan [B7L] b7 and x-files Re: [B7L] Servalan Re: [B7L] b7 and x-files Re: [B7L] Servalan Re: [B7L] Servalan Re: [B7L] Servalan Re: [B7L] Servalan [B7L] Servalan [B7L] Zines and Misc. Soolin [was Re: [B7L] Servalan] Re: [B7L] Paul Darrow Interview Re: [B7L] Four drabbles (was re: Fandoms crossed over with B7) Re: [B7L] Zines Re: [B7L] Servalan Re: Soolin [was Re: [B7L] Servalan] Re: [B7L] Servalan Re: [B7L] Zines Re: [B7L] Servalan Re: [B7L] Zines Brian Blessed ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1999 18:52:55 +0100 From: "Deborah Day" To: "blakes7" Subject: [B7L] Paul Darrow Interview Message-ID: <004901bec70f$36a6f1e0$3796bc3e@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well, it sure was a nice surprise to read the Paul Darrow transcript from Cambridge all those years ago. In the immortal words of Max Boyce, "I know, because I was there". Unfortunately the only things I can remember now was all the coming and going and that he said he had an auntie in Florida and he was going there for a holiday. So, it is really nice to be able to see all the rest. The room was absolutely packed, and although you were supposed to be a Cambridge undergraduate, I managed to talk myself in as I had gone with a friend who was studying there, but I think she was one of the ones who sneaked out as she didn't really like Blakes 7 (but even so we are still friends). My grateful thanks to all the people who had to turn the knobs up to 11, yes that is one of my fave films too. Debbie Day. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Jul 1999 20:27:03 +0100 From: "Neil Faulkner" To: "lysator" Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: <000201bec717$1a2bb5c0$cf1dac3e@default> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Susan Riaz wrote: Surely fainting is merely the low-tech equivalent of Joojanta Superchromatic Peril-Sensitive sunglasses? And just how familiar were the makers of 'Alien' with B7? I wouldn't be surprised if they'd never heard of it. To me, Servalan is one of the -worst- female characters in B7, because her power is so firmly rooted in her sexual allure. This perpetuates the myth that women can only get to the top by lying on their backs, literally or figuratively. While there may be some real-world precedents for this (Eva Peron being one possibility), it generally doesn't hold true. I prefer Servalan in episodes where she's shown to be a powerful, decisive, commanding personality without having to bat her eyelashes. 'Star One' is probably her best in that regard. Shame she wasn't in that mode more often. Neil ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1999 21:47:31 +0200 From: Angria@t-online.de (Tanja Kinkel) To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Servalan Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Neil Faulkner schrieb: > > To me, Servalan is one of the -worst- female characters in B7, because her > power is so firmly rooted in her sexual allure. This perpetuates the myth > that women can only get to the top by lying on their backs, literally or > figuratively. Excuse me, but in which scenes does Servalan use her sexual allure to get to the top? We never see her sleep or flirt with any admirals or other men more powerful than her before she's president. When she's introduced, the only one she's flirting with is her aide, and while a case can be made against Servalan as a sexual molestor on the working place here, it hardly is a method to "get to the top by lying on her back". Servalan methods shown to gain more power while she's Supreme Commander are usually murderous plots (such as her idea of getting Orac for free by killing of Ensor Jr. and Marryatt), but they don't include her using her sex appeal to carry them through. As you yourself point out, her actual coup d'état is carried out efficiently and without any batting of eyelashes. Now Servalan's relationship with Avon from "Aftermath" onward certainly contains the element of using sex as part of the power struggle, but I'd say this is mutual. And in the fourth season, when she has to climb to the top all over again, she kills off one man who has the bright idea of trying to blackmail her for sex and shared power (the guy in "Traitor"), and the inspector in "Sand" who actually is in a position to harm her and placed at least on an equal level, if not higher in the Fed hierarchy to "Commissioner Sleer" doesn't fare much better. Her frightening him with nothing more than some words and a look when he has the technical advance is one of the highlights of the episode. Hardly the behaviour of a character who's supposed to sleep her way to the top. So, overall, I'd say that, cold-blooded killer & megalomaniac that she is, the allegation that her power rests on her sexual allure is one charge the character of Servalan is not guilty off. Tanja ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 23:23:12 +0200 From: Steve Kilbane To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] b7 and x-files Message-Id: <199907052223.XAA18313@whitecrow.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thinking about mapping onto X-Files, I contemplated Blake. Determined. Unbowed by threats. Working against the established authorities. Prone to withholding information from subordinates. Willing to make the masses pay a high price for the greater good. Hmm. steve ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 19:09:41 -0700 From: mistral@ptinet.net To: B7 List Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: <37816565.8BA2634C@ptinet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Neil Faulkner wrote: > To me, Servalan is one of the -worst- female characters in B7, because her > power is so firmly rooted in her sexual allure. This perpetuates the myth > that women can only get to the top by lying on their backs, literally or > figuratively. While there may be some real-world precedents for this (Eva > Peron being one possibility), it generally doesn't hold true. Well, I agree that Servalan is an awful character, but I'll have to say that I completely disagree with this reason. I don't think her power is rooted in sexual allure at all (and Tanja's listed the reasons so I'll pass on to my real point). For me, the problem with Servalan as a character (apart from the fact that I simply loathe her) is that she perpetuates the myth that an intelligent, sexy, independent, powerful woman *must* be evil, a la Snow White's stepmother, black widows, etc. In my mind this makes her a dull cliché. The conflict would be so much more interesting if Servalan believed that she was acting in the best interests of the Federation and its people, instead of serving her own selfish and sensualist agenda. (This is why I infinitely prefer Travis as the antagonist, and wish he'd gone four seasons and lost Servalan at Star One, although of course, Travis was set up as Blake's foe, and they subsequently set Servalan up as Avon's. Travis had some honor, and was a worthy opponent for Blake. To a certain extent, I've felt that putting Servalan up opposite Avon is an insult to Avon.) This bad stereotype is also the reason I'm so partial to Soolin, who is intelligent, sexy, independent, dangerous, and one of the *good guys*. I can never quite decide whether I'd wish for another season for her to develop more, or should be glad that they didn't have further chances to weaken her, as they did Jenna and Cally. Regards, Mistral P.S. Hmm. Hey Dreadful Penny! How 'bout writing us an AU in which Servalan dies at the end of season two and Travis survives? -- "We all have something to hide, and we all have something to tell; we all have a secret name; we all have a secret question-- one question that unlocks our heart."--Galen, 'Crusade' ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 18:37:38 -0700 From: mistral@ptinet.net To: B7 List Subject: Re: [B7L] b7 and x-files Message-ID: <37815DE2.FCBE352@ptinet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Steve Kilbane wrote: > Thinking about mapping onto X-Files, I contemplated Blake. > > Determined. > Unbowed by threats. > Working against the established authorities. > Prone to withholding information from subordinates. > Willing to make the masses pay a high price for the greater good. > > Hmm. Hmm, indeed. Does this mean that Blake = CSM??? Wow. Interesting. ??? Mistral -- "We all have something to hide, and we all have something to tell; we all have a secret name; we all have a secret question-- one question that unlocks our heart."--Galen, 'Crusade' ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 07:35:59 +0100 (BST) From: Judith Proctor To: Lysator List Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Tue 06 Jul, mistral@ptinet.net wrote: > For me, the problem with Servalan as a character (apart > from the fact that I simply loathe her) is that she perpetuates > the myth that an intelligent, sexy, independent, powerful > woman *must* be evil, a la Snow White's stepmother, > black widows, etc. In my mind this makes her a dull cliché. > The conflict would be so much more interesting if Servalan > believed that she was acting in the best interests of the > Federation and its people, instead of serving her own selfish > and sensualist agenda. I've always felt that in Star One, she was acting in the best interests of the Federation. I think she genuinely felt that a military coup was the only way to get a fast, well-organised response. Judith -- http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 - Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs, pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth Thomas, etc. (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 03:18:04 EDT From: AdamWho@aol.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se (lysator) Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-07-05 14:50:39 EDT, Neil Faulkner writes: << To me, Servalan is one of the -worst- female characters in B7, because her power is so firmly rooted in her sexual allure. This perpetuates the myth that women can only get to the top by lying on their backs, literally or figuratively. While there may be some real-world precedents for this (Eva Peron being one possibility), it generally doesn't hold true. >> Servalan used her sexual allure to her benefit, but wasn't powerful because of it. Servalan gained so much power because of ruthlessness and intelligence. As a matter of fact, I think Serv's glamour worked for her in two ways, one being sex appeal helping her rise through the ranks, but also causing people to underestimate her. An enemy who saw Kasabi would immediately fear her, but Servalan could play on an enemy's emotions and prejudices, and knife them in the back as soon as she had the chance. Servalan is one of the first female characters I've seen who mix glamour and villiany in such a tough way. She walks through rooms in those white gowns, dictating orders and finding scapegoats, but in other episodes manages to singlehandedly outwit Avon, Dayna, the Sarrons on horseback, and Hal Mellanby. I think the complexities in Servalan are what make her so fascinating, perhaps more fascinating than a Kasabi or Ripley knockoff. Jacqueline Pearce definitely helps, she deserves an equal amount of credit with the writers themselves. Her strength and subtelty caused Serv to fall into a much higher class than the usual sci-fi villianesses. Especially The Rani, played by Kate O Mara as so hysterically over the top I thought she should have been named The Termite, for all her endless scenery chewing. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 03:25:17 EDT From: AdamWho@aol.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se (lysator) Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: <458c00ed.24b3095d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-07-05 14:50:39 EDT, Neil Faulkner writes: << I prefer Servalan in episodes where she's shown to be a powerful, decisive, commanding personality without having to bat her eyelashes. 'Star One' is probably her best in that regard. Shame she wasn't in that mode more often. >> My favorite Servalan episode is "Children of Auron", because that's Jacqueline Pearce's best performance. To go from giving a plague to an entire planet, then crying as you feel a part of yourself die, to killing the guard who lied to you, a wide range of emotions, and she played them all perfectly. That single tear rolling down her cheek, when she says "I felt my own babies dying.", superb. Almost as good as that chilling moment in Rumours of Death when we first see a bruised Servalan shackled in the wine cellar. As a side note, I also love Servalan's outfit in Children of Auron, the best outfit I've seen her wear so far. She should have worn black more often. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 03:36:54 EDT From: AdamWho@aol.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: <152823d6.24b30c16@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-07-05 23:26:21 EDT, mistral@ptinet.net writes: << For me, the problem with Servalan as a character (apart from the fact that I simply loathe her) is that she perpetuates the myth that an intelligent, sexy, independent, powerful woman *must* be evil, a la Snow White's stepmother, black widows, etc. >> Don't Cally and Jenna break that myth? I think did a fairly good job of representing both sides, even if they stuck Cally and Jenna with teleport duty too often. <> And gets plastic surgery to morph back into Stephen Greif.... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 10:11:51 +0200 From: Angria@t-online.de (Tanja Kinkel) To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Servalan Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT AdamWho@aol.com schrieb: > My favorite Servalan episode is "Children of Auron", because that's > Jacqueline Pearce's best performance. To go from giving a plague to an entire > planet, then crying as you feel a part of yourself die, to killing the guard > who lied to you, a wide range of emotions, and she played them all perfectly. > That single tear rolling down her cheek, when she says "I felt my own babies > dying.", superb. Almost as good as that chilling moment in Rumours of Death > when we first see a bruised Servalan shackled in the wine cellar. I agree, though my choice for best performance and best Servalan episode is "Sand" (which you will see in the fourth season). Here, too, Jacqueline Pearce gets a chance to display the full range of ruthlessness to vulnerability, without appearing once as weak or helpless. > > As a side note, I also love Servalan's outfit in Children of Auron, the best > outfit I've seen her wear so far. She should have worn black more often. Don't worry, she does, for the rest of the series. I don't know whether it's true or not, but SFX claimed that Jacqueline Pearce made the deliberate decision of changing Servalan's outfits post "Children of Auron" to black, as a sign of mourning for the embryos she killed. Anyway, another dark classic comes in "Terminal" - simple and elegant. Though my favourite remains the "Rumours of Death" dress, with the pearls. Tanja ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 20:23:38 +1000 From: Katling To: "blakes7@lysator.liu.se" Subject: [B7L] Zines and Misc. Message-ID: <3781D92A.E5D9EC22@primus.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Been sorta quietly following the threads about zines and submissions and so on. I'm not going to talk anyone out of starting up one [even considered it myself - but who hasn't?] but I would be mighty cautious - and take advice from those with more wisdom on the matter than I. ;) Though I've got pieces lurking that I'm willing to submit to any start-up zine. Gen only. I've never been able to write non-gen. :P Australian zines - can anyone confirm what's happening with Chronicles?? Pat Patera! Nice to see your name appear again. ;) I remember you from right back when I made my first postings ever. Over a year now - I was the student at Sydney Uni. :) And many welcomes to those new to the list(s) - I'm a definate lurker but I do contribute. Sometimes. When I remember to? Katrina. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 20:23:34 +1000 From: Katling To: "blakes7@lysator.liu.se" Subject: Soolin [was Re: [B7L] Servalan] Message-ID: <3781D926.781CDAE4@primus.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > This bad stereotype is also the reason I'm so partial to > Soolin, who is intelligent, sexy, independent, dangerous, > and one of the *good guys*. I can never quite decide > whether I'd wish for another season for her to develop > more, or should be glad that they didn't have further > chances to weaken her, as they did Jenna and Cally. > Oooh. Another Soolin fan? It amazed me somehow, that out of a part which often seemed rather generic [and some bits were originally written for Cally!] that Glynis Barber managed to produce such a consistent, powerful and independent character. I have to admit I's almost glad they didn't write more of her. Imagine Soolin instead of Dayna in episodes like Animals. [not that I hate Animals, it was just a dreadful story for character development] She's also my favourite character for stories but there doesn't seem to be many Soolin stories about. :( Katrina. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 13:22:49 +0100 From: "Una McCormack" To: "lysator" Subject: Re: [B7L] Paul Darrow Interview Message-ID: <015201bec7ab$4b8c6620$0d01a8c0@hedge> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Debbie Day wrote: > Well, it sure was a nice surprise to read the Paul Darrow transcript from > Cambridge all those years ago. In the immortal words of Max Boyce, "I know, > because I was there". Unfortunately the only things I can remember now was > all the coming and going and that he said he had an auntie in Florida and he > was going there for a holiday. So, it is really nice to be able to see all > the rest. How great that you were there! I'm glad you enjoyed reading it. > My grateful thanks to all the people who had to turn the knobs up > to 11, yes that is one of my fave films too. Indeed, many thanks to everyone who answered my plea and helped with this. I'm pleased I got the side with all the politics in it, and I thought the Edward Heath story was one of the best B7 anecdotes I've ever heard. Una ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 13:26:23 +0100 From: "Una McCormack" To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Four drabbles (was re: Fandoms crossed over with B7) Message-ID: <015301bec7ab$4bf2c910$0d01a8c0@hedge> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Nightmare's End? > > > Surrounded by troopers, Avon raised his gun and... > > Avon woke up screaming. Moaning, he stumbled from the bed and trudged into > the bathroom, unsurprised to hear the shower running. Then he opened the > door, startling the two people inside. > "Hey, Avon," Blake said, "have we reached Star One yet?" > "Umm..." > "Oh, hello," the other man said. "I'm Bobby Ewing." > > Avon woke up screaming. He tumbled clumsily to the floor and froze. Someone > was definitely using his shower. He crawled into the bathroom and threw open > the curtain. > "My shower's busted," Gan explained, "so Blake said I could use yours > instead." The horror... the horror... > Be glad my idea for "Cally McBeal" was just too big to turn into a drabble. Can we have it as a double decker drabble, then? Una ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1999 20:24:00 +0100 From: "Neil Faulkner" To: "lysator" Subject: Re: [B7L] Zines Message-ID: <000701bec7b5$b0cebf60$80438cd4@default> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-7" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Murray wrote: +ADw- I agree with you about Servalan, but would say that the trend in strong female characters in science-fiction really started with that of Princess Leia in 'Star Wars', a character seen by people of all ages. While a princess, she was a tough cookie, able to insult Tarkin and Darth Vader, able to stand up to torture, and able to fight once released. I always loved her telling Han Solo that he was now to take orders from her+ACEAPA-g+AD4APg- Far further back than Her Worshipfulness, I think (and her best line was in Empire - 'I am NOT a committee'). Didn't Dale Arden once take the helm of one of those spluttery firework things in the old Flash Gordon serials? And what about Maria in Metropolis, inciting revolution left right and centre? (Can't comment on the title character of Die Frau Im Mond (1929) since I've never seen it.) B7 merely picked up and continued with a tradition that was already well established. Its apogee was probably Ripley in the Alien films, before it dissolved into the Bikini Amazon Fetish Parade (which was probably all it ever was anyway). Neil ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 07:13:20 -0700 From: mistral@ptinet.net To: B7 List Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: <37820F00.E36441A4@ptinet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Judith Proctor wrote (re Servalan): > I've always felt that in Star One, she was acting in the best interests of the > Federation. I think she genuinely felt that a military coup was the only way to > get a fast, well-organised response. I'd have to say mixed motives here, inasmuch as she did take advantage of the opportunity, and knew she was doing it. She has a line something like: 'I will not be ruler of a ruined empire.' She doesn't seem to have any intention of releasing her hold on the government when the crisis is over. I'd say the best Servalan is when she's playing politics with bureaucrats-- with Rontane and Bercol in Seek-Locate-Destroy, and with Joban in 'Hostage'. In these scenes she seems clever, ruthless, ambitious, and a dangerous enemy-- but not a sick, twisted, 'tasteless megalomaniac', as she later appears. Or perhaps I'm just prejudiced against people who are stupid or vain enough to wear spiked heels and formal gowns to go hiking? Grins, Mistral -- "We all have something to hide, and we all have something to tell; we all have a secret name; we all have a secret question-- one question that unlocks our heart."--Galen, 'Crusade' ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 09:01:05 -0700 From: mistral@ptinet.net To: B7 List Subject: Re: Soolin [was Re: [B7L] Servalan] Message-ID: <37822840.59B0506C@ptinet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Katling wrote: > Oooh. Another Soolin fan? Absolutely positively. > It amazed me somehow, that out of a part which often > seemed rather generic [and some bits were originally written for Cally!] that > Glynis Barber managed to produce such a consistent, powerful and independent > character. I have to admit I's almost glad they didn't write more of her. > Imagine Soolin instead of Dayna in episodes like Animals. [not that I hate > Animals, it was just a dreadful story for character development] Maybe Glynis Barber could have kept her from the deterioration visited on the other female characters, as she did such a good job with what she was given. > She's also my favourite character for stories but there doesn't seem to be many > Soolin stories about. :( Yes, it's really sad. I think she makes the best viewpoint character, except for Vila. As characters go, she's practically perfect. I'd just wish for one or two more background details to hang some personal backstory on. That may be why there's not much of her in fanfiction, you pretty much have to make her up out of thin air. I love the way she interacts with each member of the Scorpio crew; Soolin and Dayna teasing Vila in 'Orbit' is priceless. She also handles Avon better than anyone else except Blake does. (I quite like the idea of A/Soo.) My only complaint is that to have Soolin and Liberator in the same story, you have to go AU. Oh, well, can't have everything, can you? Cheers, Mistral -- "We all have something to hide, and we all have something to tell; we all have a secret name; we all have a secret question-- one question that unlocks our heart."--Galen, 'Crusade' ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 08:22:12 -0700 From: mistral@ptinet.net To: B7 List Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: <37821F23.BBED44F4@ptinet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Adam wrote: > In a message dated 99-07-05 23:26:21 EDT, mistral@ptinet.net writes: > > << For me, the problem with Servalan as a character (apart > from the fact that I simply loathe her) is that she perpetuates > the myth that an intelligent, sexy, independent, powerful > woman *must* be evil, a la Snow White's stepmother, > black widows, etc. >> > > Don't Cally and Jenna break that myth? I think did a fairly good job of > representing both sides, even if they stuck Cally and Jenna with teleport > duty too often. As far as I am concerned, they completely ruined Cally; they took a passionate freedom fighter and turned her into a whining wimp. The only places she gets my sympathy anymore are Time Squad, Bounty, and the first halves of Duel and Shadow. The Cally of Time Squad and Bounty would have blasted her way into Servalan's palace and executed her for genocide, not whined at Avon about the pointlessness of revenge. I was very nearly glad to see her go, considering what a total drag she had become. (This is probably because she was originally my favorite of the women.) She should have been a strong counterpart for Blake, a committed co-rebel amidst his reluctant gang of criminals. What a waste. Jenna fared somewhat better, but she was supposed to be a *smuggler*, for goodness' sake, a strong, independent woman, and they should have made more out of her decision to go along with Blake, instead of just having her cave in (apparently because her hormones were on overdrive). Once or twice she should have had a better idea, and Blake should have *listened* to her, as he did to Avon, instead of patronizing her (as in Killer). It irks me no end that in Killer, they gave Blake more understanding of the history of spaceflight, exploration, and navigation than they did Jenna; it falls under her area of expertise, after all. Avon at least treated her as an equal, whereas Blake often treated her like a child; and the weakest part of Jenna's characterization is that it never bothers her. She complained 'Tarvin underestimates me', but Blake was far more guilty of that. Another example is Blake's agreement to hand Liberator over to Avon when he was through with it. Avon's assumption that this should be done is consistent characterization, but Jenna had IMHO *more* claim to Liberator than Avon, and I think Blake should have taken that into consideration. I'm happy to see that, from what I've read, Jenna comes off better in fanfiction; but portrayals of Cally are all over the place. So, no, I guess I don't think they break the stereotype, because they're not anything like as strong as Servalan. Jenna, being the female lead and second name in the credits, should have been. IMHO, Mistral -- "We all have something to hide, and we all have something to tell; we all have a secret name; we all have a secret question-- one question that unlocks our heart."--Galen, 'Crusade' ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 12:16:29 EDT From: AdamWho@aol.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Zines Message-ID: <1c2a556e.24b385dd@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-07-06 09:44:48 EDT, N.Faulkner@tesco.net writes: << And what about Maria in Metropolis, inciting revolution left right and centre? >> In a message dated 99-07-06 09:44:48 EDT, Neil Faulkner writes: << And what about Maria in Metropolis, inciting revolution left right and centre? >> Were the two Marias ever more than stereotypes? Human Maria was sweet and kind, although she did try to help all the workers to fight for change, but she did it with kindness and understanding. Maria 2 was nothing more than a brazen, out of control robot fascimile who used the power and control of the workers the human Maria originally gathered. She used the power only to destroy Metropolis. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 19:19:26 -0700 From: Pat Patera To: B7 Lysator Subject: Re: [B7L] Servalan Message-ID: <378167AE.6AAEADA5@netzero.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tanja Kinkel wrote: re" > Neil Faulkner wrote: > > To me, Servalan is one of the -worst- female characters in B7, because her > > power is so firmly rooted in her sexual allure. ... > > Excuse me, but in which scenes does Servalan use her sexual allure to get to the > top? We never see her sleep or flirt with any admirals or other men more > powerful than her before she's president. > Hardly the behaviour of a character who's supposed to sleep her way to the top. > So, overall, I'd say that, cold-blooded killer & megalomaniac that she is, the > allegation that her power rests on her sexual allure is one charge the character > of Servalan is not guilty off. > Tanja, your rebuttal was perfect. Wish I'd said it! :-) I'd like to add: Servalan is portrayed with the same sexual behavior that no one would find surprising in a man. A powerful man would flirt with his young secretary (aka Supreme Commander Servalan and subordinate Ray). He would take along a girlfriend/escort when vacationing at a casino resort (aka President Servalan and Jerriere). He would flirt with and bed any woman he found attractive at the moment (aka Servalan and Jarvik). He would play highly enjoyable flirtatious games with any woman his business/power equal, enemy or not - perhaps especially enemy! - (aka Servalan and Avon). He would brush off any "inferior" woman who attempted to attach herself to his money/power (aka Servalan and Travis II in "The Keeper"). I enjoy watching Servalan use her sexuality as both pleasure and weapon - exactly the same way men use theirs: to both charm and intimidate women. Viva Sexy Servalan! Pat Patera http://www.geocities.com/area51/1707 ________________________________________________________ NetZero - We believe in a FREE Internet. Shouldn't you? Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 09:02:21 -0700 From: Pat Patera To: B7 Lysator Subject: Re: [B7L] Zines Message-ID: <3782288D.FEE909EE@netzero.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tigerm1019@aol.com wrote: > It isn't quite the same. Among other things, it's very hard to curl up in > bed with a cup of tea and a computer monitor.;-) What I meant was that fen now write email posts *instead* of writing zine stories. > Seriously though, many fans do not have internet access, even if they have e-mail. They only need the email access to spend all those hours reading and writing lists rather than reading and writing zines. > Also, I've seen some > excellent fanfic on websites like The Aquitar Files and the archive at the B7 > fanwriters' site, but there isn't too much B7 fanfic on the web. Fortunately, there is enough existing B7 fanfic to keep you busy collecting and reading for the rest of your life! > Another > problem I've often encountered with netfic in various fandoms is stories that > are um, less than good. Perhaps this, too, is an outshoot of email, where we write fast and fling. It can get to be a habit in all one's writing. > One thing I like about paper zines is that anything that gets printed has to > have gone through some kind of editing process. You'd be surprised how many editors touch not a word, but print whatever they receive. Pat P http://www.geocities.com/area51/1707 ________________________________________________________ NetZero - We believe in a FREE Internet. Shouldn't you? Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 12:09:44 -0700 From: "pennyk" To: "b7" Subject: Brian Blessed Message-ID: <002f01bec7e3$73210500$9aaaf5d1@behemoth> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Brian Blessed is really making the rounds....Star Wars Episode I and Disney's Tarzan. Peace, Penny -------------------------------- End of blakes7-d Digest V99 Issue #208 **************************************