From tariqas-digest-approval@europe.std.com Wed Sep 18 14:20:05 1996 Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 14:27:06 -0400 (EDT) From: tariqas-digest-approval@europe.std.com Reply-To: tariqas-digest@world.std.com To: tariqas-digest@world.std.com Subject: tariqas-digest V1 #129 tariqas-digest Friday, 6 September 1996 Volume 01 : Number 129 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Zainuddin Ismail Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 07:44:31 +0800 (SGT) Subject: Re: Prayer for World Peace As Salamu 'alaikum waRahmatullahi waBarakatuhu. Brother Michael J.Moore America gathered some of the nations of the world to sanction its carpent bombing of Baghdad.It was not aimed, innocent friend , at Saddam and its cronies only.I am not pro-Ayatollah at all, but earlier America armed Saddam to attack Iran and the secularists at one time were so happy to support Baathist Saddam because he was destabilising the Islamic Nations and their unity.This was the policy cultivated by Michael Aflaq who is the theorist of Baathism.Anyway he did not spell it out but you can read between the lines provided you are not so innocent as yourself.People are not just killed during the bombing of Baghdad they are incinerated , elders, children, babies which Saddam will never show on his own TV.My personal acquaintance Saiyyid Mahdi al Hakim was killed in the early 80s by Saddam.He was then the 17th member of the Hakeem clan to be assasinated by the American supported Saddam.Today almost all the adults of clan are gone but they keep all the records of the Baathist governent which is a terrible dictatorship . I am surprised that despite CNN you believe that only a few people are killed.What Americans are doing is not to stop Saddam or to help the Northern Kurds whom I love -they are the people of Salahuddin Ayyubi Al Kurdi - but to create pretext after pretext so that they can come in and control the oil through the pretext of some international arrangement. These are the same people who carpet bombed Vietnam , Cambodia, Laos , who dropped Atomic Bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki even when the war was turning in the favour of the allies. Carpet bombing goes on together with the chanting of the Lord's prayer at the instance of the Army's chaplains..America again supported the action of pro-American Turkey in killing the Kurds.so again they are bluffing.If American is genuine they would have intervened in Bosnia ,removed all their cronies who are partly responsible for the killing in Afghanistan and publicised more about the cruelties perpetrated by Yeltsin in Chechnea.No ! One cannot be selective when it comes to the aid of oppressed people.America has much more resources but at any one time the war-lobby who make billions from wars ultimately makes the decision not Reagen not Clinton.Obviously they are very subtle and the poor American public like people everywhere are simply not told all of the truth.Surely there must be a much better way.How about asking Ramsey Clark the former Attorney General of USA for his views! Why the blackout on Ramsey Clark's views ? No! the damage is done to thousands of people At 11:47 9/5/96 -0700, you wrote: >Hello Zainuddin, >Let me ask you this. Do you think it is ok to kill a few people in order >to save the lives of many? I believe that this is the primary >justification >for the attack. Surely you must know about how Saddam has used chemical >warfare on the Kurds in the past, killing 10's of thousands of men women >and children. (At least this is what I am told.) Myself, I do not know >if >the action is justified or not, I just thank allah that he has not put >me >in the position of having to make that decision. > >Zainuddin Ismail wrote: >> >> As Salamu alaikum waRahmatullahi waBarakatuhu! >> The Americans are cruelly bombing Iraq although the sins of the latter are >> largely the work of Saddam Hussain himself a one-time stooge of USA and >> presently of Satan.The people , the children are innocent. > >Yes they are innocent and it is reprehensible that Saddam uses them for >a human shield to protect this military machine. And it is sad when >bombs >miss there target and kill innocent people. And it is sad that we as >humans >cannot figure out how to solve problems without resulting to physical >force. > >> Is this the work >> of a Christian nation ? > >No, this is not a Christian nation! It is a nation of many religions. >Inshallah >the balance between these religions will become better as more brothers >and >sisters come and make this country their home. I Pray that more Muslims >will >come and more Jews, and more Wiccans, and Shamans and Pagans, Hindus, >Buddists >Sieks, Atheists, and Agnostics. >Then these people will become members of our secular government and it >will >not favor or hinder any religion. > >> Every day believers such as yourself are praying for peace.We Muslims pray >> for peace five times a day with the following prayer >> >"Prayer without Knowledge" has no power. If it did, then there would be >no >schools because every child prays that schools will disappear. >This is what Idres Shah says and I believe it. > >> Everyday Muslims go about wishing peace for everyone with the words As >> Salamu alaikum w.w.The more people realise that they are actually praying >> for peace ceaselessly the faster peace will come but it looks like war >> mongers and America's war lobby are praying for war actually for Armageddon >> the Last Great War. >I hate war and wonder if anything justifies it, but I think you are >worng here. >I don't believe that America's war lobby are praying for Armageddon. >Maybe I am >just naive but I believe we want peace and fairness. > > >-- >Michael J. Moore > ------------------------------ From: maarof Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 11:29:43 +0800 Subject: Re: Paraclete #1 (short side bar) On Wed, 4 Sep 1996, dlb@severn.wash.inmet.com (David Barton) wrote: >James Hallam writes: > > Pardon but wasn't Moses (Peace not knowing whether He was buried or > not) unable to follow Khider(Peace knowing that there was no > burial) and in that consideration how then does He relate to > Jesus(again Peace knowing there was no burial) and Mohammed(and yet > again Peace knowing there was no burial)? > >I cannot tell if this was directed to my response or not; however, if >it was I am totally unable to andwer it. My posts have been from a >Christian perspective, and since neither Khidr nor Mohammed are a part >of Christian theology, I am completely at sea. I apologize, and hope >that the more knowledgeable readers of this list may help you. > >Again, sorry. > > > Dave Barton <*> > dlb@wash.inmet.com )0( > http://www.intermetrics.com/~dlb > > Assalamualaikum, Musa (as), The Blessed One (Khidr), Isa (as) and Muhammad (saw) some trivia: - ------------ Musa (as) and The Blessed One (Khidr) lived in the same time (ref Quran. Please note al-Quran does not named Khidr) Musa__? yrs__Isa__500/600yrs__Muhammad__1416yrs__present The place where Isa was born is still preserved today. The grave of Muhammad (saw) in Medina, according to a book I read, lies next to 4 imams of Islam -- Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthman and Ali. The book mentioned a space reserved next to Muhammad's grave either for Iman Mahdi or Isa (as) during his second coming.) ------------------------------ From: woodsong@juno.com (Carol Woodsong) Date: Fri, 06 Sep 1996 02:31:51 EDT Subject: Re: Prayer for World Peace Hello, dear friends, >No, this is not a Christian nation! It is a nation of many religions. >Inshallah the balance between these religions will become better as more >brothers and sisters come and make this country their home. I Pray that more >Muslims will come and more Jews, and more Wiccans, and Shamans and Pagans, >Hindus, Buddists Sieks, Atheists, and Agnostics. pray, let us all become /better/ Christians, Muslims, Jews, Wiccans, Hindus, Buddhists, etc. I pray that all who live here, all who live anywhere, everywhere on this Beautiful Earth... come to realize that only through Allah can we have peace... only through Allah can we change the world... only through Allah can we /create/ Peace... here and now. Whatever we call ourselves... we are all children of the Great Spirit. Let us learn to live together in peace, as children learning how to truly love one another --- Pray, we all come to know the Peace of God... >I hate war and wonder if anything justifies it, but I think you are I cannot participate in war. sometimes i feel as though i am participating indirectly in war when 'my country' commits such acts. This is certainly not an easy question! There have been those who withhold their taxes that would be used towards war... and those who intentionally live below the poverty level, thereby paying no tax... many times i feel i should /do/ something.... but i do not know what.... War will be with us, i think.... until we realize that violence/force/oppression is not the answer, it merely perpetuates that which it attempts to end. I know that before we can have world peace, enough of us must find /personal/ Peace... within our hearts... Isn't this place a start?... we love one another, even with such vast difference in belief, cultural differences... all kinds of things that might cause us to become hostile. But, what i see here is love -- attempts at getting beyond surface differences and looking at that which truly makes us brothers and sisters... LOVE. We call it by different names... and we argue about certain aspects... :) but deep down, we know... we are ALL ONE. What i do to any one of you, i do to myself... I will keep praying for Peace.... world peace, peace between my brothers and sisters... and peace in my heart, that i may bring peace to others... God Willing... with love, yondanoota ------------------------------ From: Lilyan Kay Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 01:50:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Prayer for World Peace asalaam-u-aleikum In my opinion Br. Zainuddin is completely accurate in his description of American foreign policy in general and specifically related to Iraq. As he has described so well, the present regime only exists due to American efforts to destabilize Iran during the 80's. Besides the resulting inestimable loss to the umma of Islamic scholars and religious leaders such as the Hakim family, Muhammad Baqir Sadr and his sister Bint al Huda, there have been and continue to be the anonymous millions who continue to pay the price. During the first 2 months of the 1991 Kurdish refugee crisis, 12% of all infants died. High infant and child mortality has continued as a result of war and economic sanctions. While simultaneously exhorting the Iraqi people to rise up and overthrow the government, the Bush administration looked away as the people of southern Iraq attempted to do so and were mowed down by Saddam's US trained and stocked war machine. The marshlands of the south were drained, destroying the unique ecosystem and ancient way of life of the people who had lived there for thousands of years. Now it appears that these horrors are to be escalated again. It is continually asserted by the American press that past and present actions against the Iraqi people have 'taught Saddam a lesson'. What is wrong with this picture? Lily ------------------------------ From: maarof Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:08:22 +0800 Subject: Re: Prayer for World Peace Assalamualaikum Sometimes words alone are not enough, especially \we\ who are casual oberservers of war in \far away\ places. When we read \angry\ words, our prayer, sometimes, is also a prayer in anger, even though we thought we pray for peace. I like the explanation of sacrifice that comes with charity. A litlle prayer from sincere hearts, not asking for anything, but for God's love only -- I pray this is the prayer from victims -- in Kurdistan, Iraq and us -- the casual observers in this list. With this thought, I read your words and pray with you Carol salam On Fri, 06 Sep 1996, you wrote: [...] >I cannot participate in war. sometimes i feel as though i am >participating indirectly in war when 'my country' commits such acts. >This is certainly not an easy question! There have been those who >withhold their taxes that would be used towards war... and those who >intentionally live below the poverty level, thereby paying no tax... many >times i feel i should /do/ something.... but i do not know what.... >War will be with us, i think.... until we realize that >violence/force/oppression is not the answer, it merely perpetuates that >which it attempts to end. I know that before we can have world peace, >enough of us must find /personal/ Peace... within our hearts... > >Isn't this place a start?... we love one another, even with such vast >difference in belief, cultural differences... all kinds of things that >might cause us to become hostile. But, what i see here is love -- >attempts at getting beyond surface differences and looking at that which >truly makes us brothers and sisters... LOVE. We call it by different >names... and we argue about certain aspects... :) but deep down, we >know... we are ALL ONE. What i do to any one of you, i do to myself... > > >I will keep praying for Peace.... world peace, peace between my brothers >and sisters... and peace in my heart, that i may bring peace to others... >God Willing... > >with love, >yondanoota > > > ------------------------------ From: i-k@dircon.co.uk Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 12:35:25 +0100 Subject: Dance / | \ | || o_\__,_|_s o )/|_w_|| ( : ( Assalamu alaikum I have been lurking here from another spiritual discussion group by kind invitation of one of your number. Thanks to which I have made a point of going to see Independence Day, and it is heartening to see there are others who, like me, have been impressed by the spiritual content which is sometimes to be found in Babylon 5. I would be interested in obtaining a FAQ (list of frequently asked questions) for this group if one exists. Does anyone know (I'm making this enquiry for a friend) where one can learn Sufi dancing in London? A friend who learnt Sufi dancing a while back, tells me he learnt it off a master from Turkey. I'm ignorant in such matters, but is it the same as the 'Whirling Dervishes Dance'? In his case he did not wear a conical hat, but a Fez instead. He said he used to get the sensation it was not he who was spinning, but that he was standing still and it was the whole room around him that was spinning. He carried on for a whole year until one day it caught up with him and he got violently sick (from the whirling). He also told me there was no requirement, in his case, to have any acquaintance of Sufi teachings. Is this so? In the One Light Ivan ------------------------------ From: pathway@dnet.net (John Womack) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 09:23:59 -0500 Subject: Who Prays for Peace? >As Salamu 'alaikum waRahmatullahi waBarakatuhu. >Brother Michael J.Moore >America gathered some of the nations of the world to sanction its carpent >bombing of Baghdad. together with the chanting of the Lord's prayer at >the instance of the Army's chaplains.. Hello friend. What is the Prayer for Peace? Surely not man's prayer, we love fighting each other too much. It must be God's prayer. We're lucky. We have God to pray to; God's not so lucky, God has to pray to us. Yes, we - - all of us - have been slow to hear that prayer, and have surrendered much to governmental and religious organizations that need enemies in order to survive. Too often we let them tell us "who" we are, and what we "must" do. And you are right, they are very successful in this endeavor because they use the most powerful weapon in the world, far more destructive than any nuclear energy: it is called Hate; but Hate won't burn unless we let our souls be poured into it's flame. Those of us, you and me, and many others, who are committed to spiritual exploration, carry within our hearts the great bond between man and God. Together we've explored the deserts and mountains, the polar regions, and the depths of the seas, and even gone to the moon. Let us now explore the hearts of our fellow human beings. Friend, I behold your heart - and I ask "Are these things, at which I am now looking, really the great ancient mysteries of man?" And my guide who speaks without words replies. "Yes, my son, you are now beholding the great ancient secrets." "But ..." I am confused " ... they look like people." My guide responds. "That's because you are still looking at the covers, you must look within." May all our nafs rest in peace. John. ------------------------------ From: Well333@turbonet.com (Jacquie Weller) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 07:37:50 +0100 Subject: Re: World Peace I pray that Gods will (for peace) be done (in us) on earth as it is in heaven. I pray we cease to argue who is at fault for what and surrender our hearts to Being peace among each other and look within to settle all war with all peoples. I pray that peace is demonstrated in loving our neighbors as we love ourselves. I think this is an endless prayer in the hearts of God's people. May all hate end in me. Pray without ending to live peacefully. Kaffea Lalla ------------------------------ From: Gale Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 08:36:03 -0700 Subject: re: prayer for world peace As-salaam aleikum Lily wrote > Saddam's US trained and stocked war machine. =20 Excuse me if i'm mistaken -- but isn't it that the Iraqi war machine was = stocked primarily by Soviet/Russian weapons and military training. i = recall well the commentaries about the Kuwait war being a confrontation = between US and Soviet military machinery. Nur ------------------------------ From: Zainuddin Ismail Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 00:20:32 +0800 (SGT) Subject: Re: paraclete #2 (my concluding remarks) All Prophets taught ahimsa except when it is necessary to protect innocent lives and even then with proper response.I learnt from the Prophets , I think, but as a Muslim I learned more easily from Muhammad that is wrong to inflict pain without reason such as sport fishing, particularly with a line and hook, torturing the atmosphere and human bodies with chemicals including alcohol and tobacco ,destroying the balance of the earth with our destructive weapons , theological vampirism through destroying through the mass media the spiritual content of revealed religions and spiritual philosophies,......As an atonement for my ungrammatical verbosity a few lines : "A loaf of bread A cup of tea Me and family Tis for this we fret ? A look of love The rubbing of two sensitive brows Is an instant of eternity A touch of purity Gale , Frank, Nur , Imaan,Tanzen Maarof,and everybody else Your love is what I want You all are my mirror Despite my un-RUMI-IC language Your eloquence gives me fever " and I end with my signature poem "Your Destiny's Price" The joys of life are great Thought provoking are its pains But unless you have God in mind What truly are your gains? You are unhappy not because of what you know But what you dont realise Tis knowing God's love ,my dear Which is your Destiny's Price " Zainuddin Mohd Ismail ------------------------------ From: Lilyan Kay Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 10:02:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: pray for world peace while speaking out against oppression wa aleikum asalaam You're excused. Do a literature search on "Iraq gate" - that was the tip of the iceberg, it had been going on much longer, throughout the Iran-Iraq war and earlier. Commentators tend to capitalize on American listeners' short memories (disinformation is only as effective as its consumers are gullible). It is as though Saddam suddenly appeared out of nowhere, armed to the teeth. And they will vaguely imply that it must have been the Russians who did it. Lily On Fri, 6 Sep 1996, Gale wrote: > > Excuse me if i'm mistaken -- but isn't it that the Iraqi war machine was > stocked primarily by Soviet/Russian weapons and military training. i > recall well the commentaries about the Kuwait war being a confrontation > between US and Soviet military machinery. > > Nur > > > ------------------------------ From: Zainuddin Ismail Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 01:56:44 +0800 (SGT) Subject: Re: pray for world peace while speaking out against oppression Salams. The machinations of the anti-religion secularists whether Soviet,American or Maoist created a monster which I call Izlamic statism which is the very opposite of Islamic theodemocracy .Ayatollahism, Saudism,Zia-ul-Haqism and the ideology of those who are killing each other in Egypt , Algeria and Afghanistan are the contemporary manifestations of this illegitimate child of Middle Eastern emotionalism, materialism,statism ,secularism and nationalism.Let us look at the difference between the two.The one the opposite of the other:- IZLAMIC STATISM (Note word derived from Zulm) IslamicTheodemocracy Izlam means Evil. Islam means Peace A system of rituals divorced from Based on loving understanding of the its Sufic womb Prophet's Islam Creates emotionalism not spiritualism Stresses the spiritual and moral Has taken the worst of nationalism, Universalistic concepts secularism and statism Bans conventional weapons Has got its official clergy Promotes aesthetic culture Hatred of those who dont agree with it Bans bloody revolution Takes the most deviant interpretation Wholistic philosophy of health of hudud laws Women are the twin halves of men Anti-aesthetics , art and beauty in the theodemocracy Islamic Banking with clever substitute Implements the hudud laws according to for Riba.Service charge worse than Prophetic "Communicate with the people riba. according to their level of understand Wont agree with death sentence for Rushdie a victim of the mass media This is in accord with how the Prophet dealt with arch-apostate Abdullah Abi Sarh and others >Do a literature search on "Iraq gate" - that was the tip of the iceberg, >it had been going on much longer, throughout the Iran-Iraq war and >earlier. > >Commentators tend to capitalize on American listeners' short memories >(disinformation is only as effective as its consumers are gullible). It >is as though Saddam suddenly appeared out of nowhere, armed to the teeth. >And they will vaguely imply that it must have been the Russians who did >it. > >Lily > > > >On Fri, 6 Sep 1996, Gale wrote: > >> >> Excuse me if i'm mistaken -- but isn't it that the Iraqi war machine was >> stocked primarily by Soviet/Russian weapons and military training. i >> recall well the commentaries about the Kuwait war being a confrontation >> between US and Soviet military machinery. >> >> Nur >> >> >> > > > > ------------------------------ From: Well333@turbonet.com (Jacquie Weller) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 11:08:39 +0100 Subject: Re: World Peace What would happen if Americans moved out of Iraq. would more peace result, or more people and ethic groups be eliminated? I am not saying who is guilty and who is not, and I am sure this is more political than concerns for anyone's welfare, and more economic self interest than humanitarian. But if we put down our weapons, would there be peace, or would this encourage more destruction and war and agression on others. I wish we lived in a world where weapons of destruction were not necessary because people truly lived peacefully. I wish we could follow the way of peace. I think we want to end this tyranny. I think Americans, the ordinary people want a world where war is not necessary because everyone truly cares about the welfare of all people. But until then, there will be those who want to take from others, kill people who are different than them, torture people with no regard for human rights and dignities. What are we to do. Are we to stand back as we did when millions of peoples are sent to execution, and torture just because a government thinks they are not worthy to live. I pray for a peaceful world to manifest, so that weapons are not needed. But until then can we let people be exterminated, and cultures eliminated who have no way to protect themselves. I hate war, but I also know that there will always be those who will use war to get what they want inspite of was is good or not. I could say alright, kill me, my family, my nation...I will not fight. I don't think I could stand by and let this happen because this robs the life of people I love and care about. But I would do everything I could to eliminate the causes behind so much violence through any peaceful means available. So I am in dilema. I want to be a complete pacifist...but is this realistic or even possible in this world. Since this is a bigger problem than I can solve, I just pray God's solutions for peace will change our hearts so no killing is done. In my small way, I can turn all my ill will for anyone into love and good will and try on a daily basis to be a Peace maker...Kaffea Lalla ------------------------------ From: Zainuddin Ismail Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 02:26:40 +0800 (SGT) Subject: Re: pray for world peace while speaking out against oppression At 01:56 9/7/96 +0800, you wrote: >Salams.Lily , do carry on your very educational work.God bless you. >The machinations of the anti-religion secularists whether Soviet,American or >Maoist created a monster which I call Izlamic statism which is the very >opposite of Islamic theodemocracy .Ayatollahism, Saudism,Zia-ul-Haqism and >the ideology of those who are killing each other in Egypt , Algeria and >Afghanistan are the contemporary manifestations of this illegitimate child >of Middle Eastern emotionalism, materialism,statism ,secularism and >nationalism.Let us look at the difference between >the two.The one the opposite of the other:- > >IZLAMIC STATISM (Note word derived from Zulm) IslamicTheodemocracy >Izlam means Evil. Islam means Peace >A system of rituals divorced from Based on loving > understanding of the >its Sufic womb Prophet's Islam >Creates emotionalism not spiritualism Stresses the spiritual and moral >Has taken the worst of nationalism, Universalistic concepts >secularism and statism Bans conventional weapons >Has got its official clergy Promotes aesthetic culture >Hatred of those who dont agree with it Bans bloody revolution >Takes the most deviant interpretation Wholistic philosophy of health >of hudud laws Women are the twin halves of men >Anti-aesthetics , art and beauty in the theodemocracy >Islamic Banking with clever substitute Implements the hudud laws > according to >for Riba.Service charge worse than Prophetic "Communicate with >interest. the people their level of understanding " > > > Wont agree with death sentence for > Rushdie , a victim of the mass > media etc. > This is in accord with how > Muhammad dealt with arch-apostate > Abdullah Abi Sarh. > > > > >>Do a literature search on "Iraq gate" - that was the tip of the iceberg, >>it had been going on much longer, throughout the Iran-Iraq war and >>earlier. >> >>Commentators tend to capitalize on American listeners' short memories >>(disinformation is only as effective as its consumers are gullible). It >>is as though Saddam suddenly appeared out of nowhere, armed to the teeth. >>And they will vaguely imply that it must have been the Russians who did >>it. >> >>Lily >> >> >> >>On Fri, 6 Sep 1996, Gale wrote: >> >>> >>> Excuse me if i'm mistaken -- but isn't it that the Iraqi war machine was >>> stocked primarily by Soviet/Russian weapons and military training. i >>> recall well the commentaries about the Kuwait war being a confrontation >>> between US and Soviet military machinery. >>> >>> Nur >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > > ------------------------------ End of tariqas-digest V1 #129 *****************************