From: blakes7-d-request@lysator.liu.se Subject: blakes7-d Digest V98 #39 X-Loop: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se X-Mailing-List: archive/volume98/39 Precedence: list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="----------------------------" To: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se Reply-To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se ------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain blakes7-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 39 Today's Topics: [B7L] mandates - sorry, persondates [B7L] Paul and Michael Re: [B7L] Re: Blake's 7 & Myers-Briggs Re: [B7L] Paul and Michael Re: [B7L] Re: Blake's 7 & Myers-Briggs Re: [B7L] Re: Blake's 7 & Myers-Briggs [B7L] Tarrant: Heroic or selfish? Re: [B7L] Tarrant: Heroic or selfish? [B7L] Blake as a terrorist Re: [B7L] Blake as a terrorist [B7L] Re Forbidden Planet Re: [B7L] Blake as a terrorist Re: [B7L] The Web 1/2 Re: [B7L] Re Forbidden Planet Re: [B7L] Blake as a terrorist [B7L] Avon/Vila v Paul/Michael [B7L] Re: Gareth and BEAUTY Re: [B7L] Avon/Vila v Paul/Michael [B7L] Re: Ads Re: [B7L] The Web 1/2 [B7L] Re: Blake's manipulativeness [B7L] Altrincham [B7L] Paul's acting Re: [B7L] Re: Blake's manipulativeness Re: [B7L] Paul's acting [B7L] role playing Re: [B7L] Paul's acting Re: [B7L] role playing Re: [B7L] role playing ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 04:13:18 +1100 From: Fran Myers To: B7 Subject: [B7L] mandates - sorry, persondates Message-ID: <34DDE7AE.326@ozemail.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kathryn sez: Did Blake have a mandate from the people? Or, to put that in a negative form, was Blake *rejected* by the people? (like the IRA was) Do we have any way of knowing what the opinions of the people were in any case? If most of the people were zonked out on happy drugs, were they capable of having/giving a mandate? Or is the mandate only from misfits and rebels who aren't really "in" the society? Wow - should we stop alcoholics and drug addicts from voting? How about depressives, like me, or schizophrenics, or epileptics, who behave "normally" only by taking drugs? Fran ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 04:23:15 +1100 From: Fran Myers To: B7 Subject: [B7L] Paul and Michael Message-ID: <34DDEA03.5709@ozemail.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have to disagree with whichever one said that Michael is the better >actor, Me. In spite of the fact that the only reason I don't spend an entire con weekend gazing soulfully at Paul is that I'm too busy gazing soulfully at Gareth :-) Actually me. I said it! Fran ;o) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 10:03:25 -0800 From: Helen Krummenacker To: "Adam L. Fuller" CC: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: Blake's 7 & Myers-Briggs Message-ID: <34DDF36D.65DC@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, I'm new to the B7 mailing list, but a long-time fan. About personality types. I've never been comfortable with those tests that determine your personality type, because I feel that for every tendancy I have, there is a tendancy that pulls me in the opposite direction, and I think that is true of everyone. For example, Are you an extrovert or and introvert? is not an either/or question, because in certain situations, most people change from one to the other. As Avon put it, "The intelligent man is adaptable." Helen Krummenacker, aka Avona ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 10:22:57 -0800 From: Helen Krummenacker To: algemy@ozemail.com.au CC: B7 Subject: Re: [B7L] Paul and Michael Message-ID: <34DDF801.7860@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Paul Darrow and Michael Keating have different ways of acting that compliment each other perfectly. Michael is very expressive with the whole of his face and body, very relaxed and fluid. Paul acts with his eyes and the corners of his mouth. If you watch carefully, you can follow his entire thinking process, even in scenes where he doesn't get to speak. I will never forget the look on his face the first episode he was in, when the guy on the prison ship slapped Jenna. Paul had no lines, but was in the background. You could see there that Avon is fiercely protective of women (yes, I know he gets a little rough with Servalan, the Sarcophagus woman, and the telekinetic women at the beginning of season 4, but those were special situations, where the woman in question was trying to force her will upon everyone else. And Avon loves his freedom more than chivalry). Paul's acting is very subtle, and a person has to be good at reading faces in order to understand him. To many people Avon is an enigma, but his eyes reveal everything. Which acting style is harder? Well, I think that which is easier to read is easier to duplicate. We all know how to make faces representig fear, anger, surprise, joy. It's harder I think, to act like one is trying to surpress the emotion, and still let it show. Helen Krummenacker, aka Avona ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 13:18:44 -0600 From: Lisa Williams To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: Blake's 7 & Myers-Briggs Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980208131723.00b51224@dallas.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Adam L. Fuller wrote: >Just about every single NT that I know, including myself, cares >nothing about how their clothes look. They wear the most drab, out-of- >style clothes out there. How many good-looking NT *women* are included in your sample? For a woman, developing and using her looks is often just another skill -- one of those abilities that NTs are so relentlessly self-critical about. I wear utilitarian clothes in utilitarian circumstances: I'm sitting here right now in a sweatsuit, because it's warm, comfortable, and there's nobody here I need to impress. If I'm going to be in a situation where my looks can work for me, though, I'm a perfectionist and I do go for the spectacular, from make-up down to four-inch spike heels. I wear clothes, make-up, jewelry, that I *like*, that I enjoy because of their beauty. Keirsey doesn't say much about NTs and clothing, but he does say that "enjoyment in the beauty of an object, pleasures of design and building, pleasure in elegant functioning in possessions all motivate an NT." (That "design and building" also applies to me, btw; I design and make my non-utilitarian clothes.) Plus, NTs are marked individualists and noted for not giving a damn what anyone else thinks. I don't pay much attention to current styles and fashions -- I create my own. And I'm keeping the fancy clothes and the high heels, 'cause I like 'em. Nyah, nyah. Keirsey, incidentally, types England's Elizabeth I as an NT -- which I, a longtime devotee of Tudor history and the Tudor monarchs, would agree with. And there have been few more spectacular clotheshorses in history than Elizabeth. She used her appearance in a carefully calculated way, much as I do. And as I see Servalan doing. >As for SJs, you are wrong about that too. SJs like to be trendy too. >It's just that they can't keep up with the fast-paced fashion style >changes that SPs set. Keirsey states that SJs are primarily concerned with the "utilitarian value of property, tools, cars, clothes, and the like. Possessions should be functional and without undue ostentation." And, among the individual type profiles: "The clothes of an ISTJ tend to be practical and durable rather than in the latest style or luxurious." Hence, I see the SJ going for value and "appropriateness" rather than style. Classic, not trendy, and certainly not flashy. And probably fond of uniforms, whether military or a conservative business suit. >Myers-Briggs is a theory that asses the personality preferences of >normal people. Well, heck, that's no fun -- you've just knocked Blake, Avon, Servalan and Travis right out of the running. None of them was exactly well-balanced and mentally healthy, after all. And I'd probably consider Servalan the sanest of the four of them.... Come to think of it, what *is* a "normal" person? -- - Lisa Lisa's Frame Capture Library: http://lcw.simplenet.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 13:18:42 -0600 From: Lisa Williams To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: Blake's 7 & Myers-Briggs Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980208121733.00b91890@dallas.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Helen Krummenacker wrote: >For example, Are you an extrovert or and introvert? is not an >either/or question, because in certain situations, most people change >from one to the other. Your designation on the M-B scales isn't *intended* to be either/or, but to express an overall personality preference -- and most people do have one. All the letter does is indicate which side of the halfway point you fell on. If you're near the 50% mark, one tendency will only predominate over the other very weakly if at all; there will be many situations where you go the other way. The closer you are to one end of the scale, the less influence the other side has on you. For instance, I consistently test as 100% I. This would indicate that in almost all situations, I will react in accordance with the Introvert side of that scale -- which is very true. However, I only run about 60% J, making me a fairly weak J. And, sure enough, there are quite a few cases where I will react more like a P than a J. Overall, though, my personality is very accurately described by my INTJ rating. Often eerily so. The M-B system is also primarily descriptive, not prescriptive. You can look at someone's type, preferably with their ratings on the four scales, and get a general idea of their preferences and how they are likely to function in some situations. You cannot, however, use it to determine that a person *will* act in such-and-such a way in a given circumstance; there's too much individual variation. -- - Lisa Lisa's Frame Capture Library: http://lcw.simplenet.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 20:26:39 -0000 From: "Jenni-Alison" To: "Lysator" Subject: [B7L] Tarrant: Heroic or selfish? Message-Id: <199802082026.VAA00594@samantha.lysator.liu.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Can anyone come up with examples where Tarrant is particularly unselfish in helping or rescuing the others when he could have saved himself more easily? I was defending him as a heroic team player at Pages Bar yesterday, but could come up with only one instance (Blake, when Scorpio crashes) where he voluntarily put himself in danger to help the others get away. His disapproval of Avon in Dawn of the Gods when Avon is getting into the dodgy silver suit, seems to show that he disaproves of an "every man for himself" attitude, but his actions wouldn't have saved anyone, just stopped Avon from saving himself. Apart from being protective of women in general(Cancer, Sand, Rescue etc.), did Tarrant act Above and Beyond the Call of Duty? Enquiring minds want to know! Jenni ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 13:03:16 -0800 From: Helen Krummenacker To: "jenni-alison@dial.pipex.com"@dial.pipex.com CC: Lysator Subject: Re: [B7L] Tarrant: Heroic or selfish? Message-ID: <34DE1D94.19C@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tarrant would like to think of himself as a hero, and if he had someone to learn from, might have made one. Tarrant would have been a good right-hand man to Blake, where he could sort of be a hero-in-training for a while. He has noble ideas, I think, but doesn't have the instincts, because Federation training doesn't really prepare you to be heroic. Avon, on the other hand, doesn't care much for the idea of heroism, and yet he has an instinct for it. In "Horizon", we questions ORAC to prove he doesn't _need_ the others to survive, then goes and follows them to a place none of the others reported back from for long, in order to mount a solo rescue. At other times, when he knows he's headed for a trap, he tries to leave the others in safety, even if he has to threaten them into hanging back. Both men are basically more inclined to be heroic when the gains are worth the risks. To risk yourself is one thing, to sacrifice yourself, another thing. The # of people in jeopardy, the chances of failure, all aspects are taken into account. Tarrant would risk himself to save the rest of the crew, especially since if Avon _had_ taken the controls, the ship wouldn't have held together long enough for Tarrant to reach the teleport (at least, that _is_ how he argued Avon out of trying to switch places). They are actually similiar in their behavior (only Avon is a little more practical). But Tarrant claims the role of hero while often rejecting the risks; Avon disclaims the role in spite of often indulging in heroic behavior. Avona ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 14:59:06 -0700 From: "John J. Doherty" To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Blake as a terrorist Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980208145906.007cd950@gemini.oscs.montana.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 08:39 AM 2/7/98 +1100, Kathryn Andersen wrote: >The latter quote seems to indicate that Blake, indeed, did have popular >support, though of course he doesn't seem to have had logistical support >at all, unless you count liasons with other rebel leaders such as Avalon. The support Blake enjoyed always seemed rather vague to me. At first, there was a rebel force, but they were few and far between because the citizens were drugged into pacificity. Then there seemed to be support for Blake building, which the Federation wished to suppress. If Blake did not have popular support, which he did not seem to have at the beginning, he was a terrorist. He was fighting to impose his beliefs on a people that did not seem to want it. The drugs, of course, make one think that if the people were allowed to think for themselves, they might just support Blake. Blake seemed to have the moral ambiguity of a terrorist, the confused logic of trying to make actions that are blatantly immoral fit into your vision of a better, more wonderful world after the Fall of the Nasty People. -- John ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 22:17:58 GMT From: Iain Coleman To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake as a terrorist Message-Id: <23047.9802082217@bsauasb.nerc-bas.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Md5: pB7obh8XparNJXkVIVXnZg== > From alijd@gemini.oscs.montana.edu Sun Feb 8 22:05:08 1998 > At 08:39 AM 2/7/98 +1100, Kathryn Andersen wrote: > >The latter quote seems to indicate that Blake, indeed, did have popular > >support, though of course he doesn't seem to have had logistical support > >at all, unless you count liasons with other rebel leaders such as Avalon. > > The support Blake enjoyed always seemed rather vague to me. At first, > there was a rebel force, but they were few and far between because the > citizens were drugged into pacificity. Then there seemed to be support for > Blake building, which the Federation wished to suppress. > It seems that the Federation's hold on the systems far from Earth was fairly weak. While Blake's around, the Feds are concerned about the outer planets breaking away, and indeed they do just that after the Andromedan invasion. This suggests that the drug/pacification program was only used on Earth and perhaps systems close to Earth - presumably there were logistical problems involved in extending it further, leading the Federation to try more imaginative solutions as seen in "Countdown". Finally, in season 4, the Feds get pylene-50 - a cheap and cheerful pacifier- and Avon is rightly concerned. The upshot of this is that Blake's support was mainly in the outer worlds, where the Federation's grip was weaker. He certainly must have substantial popular sympathy for the Feds to be so worried about him. Iain ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 22:32:08 +0100 GMT From: STEVE.ROGERSON@MCR1.poptel.org.uk To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Re Forbidden Planet Message-Id: <29899558MCR1@MCR1.poptel.org.uk> Andy said: "My brother tells me that Jaqueline Pierce is signing copies of a book on 28th February at Forbidden Planet in London. Can anybody confirm this? I have no idea which book it is." Nicoline replied: "Not a book, but the first 2 tapes of the new B7 video rerelease. She will ONLY be signing these, nothing else (so you have to buy them first)." But the first two tapes will contain episodes one to four and Jaqueline wasn't in them. Sadly I can't make this cos I'm going to be at Starfury. Is anyone who is going willing to hand out Redemption flyers to the people in the queue? Let me know and I'll get some to you. cheers Steve Rogerson Redemption 99 - The Blakes 7/Babylon 5 convention 26-28 February 1999, Ashford International Hotel, Kent http://www.smof.com/redemption/ Make your own tribble! Buy a hamster and cut off its legs ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 15:42:33 -0800 From: Helen Krummenacker To: Iain Coleman CC: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake as a terrorist Message-ID: <34DE42E9.1A14@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Re: Blake's support. Also, the Alpha grades were not drugged as much, I think. Avon certainly wouldn't be who he was if he'd been on the Federation's prozac all along. Servalan certainly wasn't on anything. They were probably only drugged in cases where there was some concern as to their pollitical tendancies. Otherwise, the Federation knew that for the top minds to be truely effective, they had to be clean. The Alpha grades are most likely to be independent thinkers, too. In most cases this will result in them going along with the status quo, whether they like the politics or not, because rebellion seems impractical. Even ones with liberal tendancies will keep their politics as secret as possible, so as not to be reindoctorinated, etc. So any support Blake may have on Earth would likely start with small, secret groups of Alpha grades, who would try to sabotage the Federation's drugging mechanisms, recruit more people, and wait for the opportunity for practical movement. Blake probably hoped, and the Federation feared, these individuals would be numerous, organized and ready. Avon would doubt they would be well organized enough to create a solid power base in a very short period of time. When StarOne fell, there would not be democracy, but anarchy, and anarchy leads right back to dictatorships, more oppressive than before. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 18:28:03 -0500 (EST) From: NWOutsider To: "Blake's 7 list" Subject: Re: [B7L] The Web 1/2 Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sat, 7 Feb 1998, Judith Proctor wrote: > I agree about the head, but I always thought the Decimas were quite well done. It's the screeching that's worst but the look of the little creatures, all dressed up like a salad bar on the loose, just makes me vacillate between giggling and rolling my eyes in embarrassment for them. And then there's the Munchkin similarity problem where one idea leads to another and the next thing I know it's Blake and Avon in blue gingham dresses and it's downhill from there... > I think the Lost were from Auron, but were rejected by rest of the Auronar, In > other word, if you want to use a fancy term, they weren't part of the 'soul of > Auron'. Thus, from the Auronar, but not of them. It sounds to me like what he's trying to say is that they were from the planet (like they landed there and settled) but not part of the race indigenous to the planet. > Is this the episode where Gareth injured a leg during filming? I don't know...the only episode-specific stories I remember are the hedge incident from "Pressure Point" and the hill rolling incident which is either "Hostage" or "The Keeper" depending on whose telling the story. > The Web has always been an episode that I count among my favourites. Partly > for the Avon-Blake interaction and partly because the Decimas (to me at any > rate) were one of the series' better aliens. I think the idea was good but the execution painful, as executions are wont to be. Sue sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu htp://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html "Fly, my monkeys! Fly!" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 00:38:58 +0100 (MET) From: N van den Berg To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Re Forbidden Planet Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Steve said: >But the first two tapes will contain episodes one to four and >Jaqueline wasn't in them. That's what I thought, but it's what the Forbidden Planet posters and flyers said when I was in London last week (exactly one Saturday before the Page's Bar meeting boohoo). >Sadly I can't make this cos I'm going to be at Starfury. Very Jealous. How about a report (maybe on the Spin List?). I wish I could go there, but as I'm already going to Neutral Zone & Deliverance it's financially impossible. Nicoline ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 18:37:07 -0500 (EST) From: NWOutsider To: "Blake's 7 list" Subject: Re: [B7L] Blake as a terrorist Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sun, 8 Feb 1998, John J. Doherty wrote: > The support Blake enjoyed always seemed rather vague to me. At first, > there was a rebel force, but they were few and far between because the > citizens were drugged into pacificity. Then there seemed to be support for > Blake building, which the Federation wished to suppress. Resistance is, in fact, widespread. Avalon says there are "30 planets in this sector alone" defying the Federation; we're told in "The Way Back" that the outer worlds are demanding more autonomy and that dissidence on Earth is growing; we know from "Voice from the Past" that many of the planetary governors are ready to join a tame coup if they can do it under the guise of legality; the massacres cited in "Trial" and "Seek-Locate-Destroy" indicate rebellions and we see that other planets, like Albian and Horizon, want their independence and are ready to fight for it because they have no choice. There are also the groups led by Kasabi and Shivan and the uprising led by Hal Mellanby. Blake is not acting in a vacuum, he's part of wide-spread pattern of rebellion that could become a full-blown revolution with a little push, hence the importance (to all rebels, in the history of resistance to the Federation as laid out in "Pressure Point") of destroying Central Control/Star One. Sue sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html "Oil can what?" ------------------------------ Date: 8 Feb 1998 16:35:20 -0800 From: "de Leon.Berta E." To: "Blake's 7" Subject: [B7L] Avon/Vila v Paul/Michael Message-ID: > Fran wrote: > And Michael is much better looking than Paul. And looks more > intelligent, too. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder... (sorry, but sometimes a clishe' can still be useful) > Julia Jones wrote: > Of course, this is the sort of thing that is partly down to personal > taste, so there's no reason why we shouldn't both be right :-) Exactly!!! I disagree with Fran's comment because, to me, Avon (Paul) is the most beautiful man in the universe. I adore him (them) absolutely. But that doesn't mean I can say Fran is wrong, because it's a matter of taste. Unfortunately, I can't comment on their acting ability because I've never seen any of them in anything but B7. But, if I'm just going by what I see in B7, then I have to say Paul is the better actor. I admit that my opinion may be influenced by my complete adulation...so, it comes back again to personal taste. I agree wholeheartedly with Wendy's lovely post. Particularly the following: >Avon was the bad guy, but by virtue of sheer good looks , charm and >some wonderful dialogue, witty sharp some devastating stunts, your >all round action hero, he was the one all the women were going to >fall in love with and forgive him anything...even killing Blake > Beautifully put, Wendy. ;) Berta ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 20:15:37 EST From: penny_kjelgaard@juno.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Re: Gareth and BEAUTY Message-ID: <19980208.171139.9311.6.Penny_Kjelgaard@juno.com> Judith wrote: Hm. Don't think I can claim Gareth as good-looking. He's beautiful; I could happily look at him for hours, but what I see as beautiful certainly isn't going to be every woman's cup of tea. (There are some pictures that capture it though. I've got one on the web page from 'Merlin' and in this picture he's just looking into the distance. You get the impression there's been a major battle with lots of people killed. That picture is gorgeous - I had to remove it from my desk because it was too distracting when I was working!) Judith My dear we are soul mates. Penny _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:32:02 +1100 (EST) From: Lisa Darby To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Avon/Vila v Paul/Michael Message-Id: <199802090432.PAA04417@anugpo.anu.edu.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:00 PM 7/02/98 +0000, Wendy wrote: > >reading the posts from Julia and Fran etc regarding who is the better >actor.. > >I have to disagree with whichever one said that Michael is the better >actor, i think that Michael gave overall the most consistent >performances through the four seasons of B7, he is a fantastic actor, >however so are Paul and Gareth . > >I think that the fact that Paul plays so many 'baddie' parts is >because he finds it easier to portray that kind of character,it >appears to me that he feels comfortable with that so therefore the >performances are better although he gets typecast in that kind of >role, to a lesser extent i think Judith had found the same type of >typecasting with roles whilst doing her research on Gareth. > I think I'm going to have to chime in here - I was in London in 1985 (for the Bosworth Quincentenary for all you Ricardians out there) and had the extreme good fortune to see both Paul and Michael in stage plays. Paul was in "Run for your wife" playing the policeman and apart from one occasion where he gave the lead actors the "Avon look" for being foolish, I thought he did an excellent job of playing straight man in a comedy. As I said apart from that "look" he was totally removed from Avon (not that I didn't melt all over the theatre seat anyway every time he spoke!!). Michael was playing one of the "Memphis Mafia" to Martin Shaw's Elvis in "Are you lonesome tonight?" and again did an excellent job and was nothing like Vila. I actually got to meet Michael outside the theatre afterwards and he was just lovely - totally amazed that there were fans there waiting to see him and not Martin. All in all I think they are both excellent actors, well able to rise above stereotyping. Lisa Lisa Darby Librarian North Australia Research Unit PO Box 41321 Casuarina NT 0811 Australia lisa.darby@anu.edu.au Ph : +61 8 89220031 Fax : +61 8 89220055 http://online.anu.edu.au/naru/welcome.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 22:25:49 -0800 From: Ovina Maria Feldman To: B7 Subject: [B7L] Re: Ads Message-ID: <34DEA16D.8C61E696@gte.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This has nothing to do with B7, but has anyone else noticed the Kokanee ad on CBUT (Canadian TV). It's part of the Olympic promos. It features Godizilla swallowing then splitting out a nasty tasting snowboarder. It's brilliant! It is just about the best thing shown on the Olympics so far. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 22:50:39 -0800 From: Ovina Maria Feldman To: B7 Subject: Re: [B7L] The Web 1/2 Message-ID: <34DEA73F.689F76DF@gte.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Was Blake's hiding of the energy cells under the moss at his feet lame or what? Clearly in this episode Blake had a lot to learn about duplicity. But did he ever get better at it? I don't really think so -- he was always one to deal with people and situations directly and forthrightly. If he had understood underhandedness better, he might not have been killed by his best ally. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 20:14:43 +1000 From: Tim Richards & Narrelle Harris To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Re: Blake's manipulativeness Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980209201443.007ac180@wire.net.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Julia said: >That's the impression I get from several of the things Blake does - he's >sincere, but he's also doing it for effect. Which I see as manipulation, As I see it, every human being everywhere in the world says things - both truth and lies of varying intensity - for specific effect at some time or another. It is human nature to present facts, opinions, points of view and even mere anecdotes with some slant or other to either convince the listener to do something(do the dishes, walk the dog) or believe something (I am a cleverer person than everyone I work with). It's rarely done with conscious, malicious effort (though some people are very good at it - anyone in public life, for example). Thank heavens none of us are scrutinised as closely or regularly in our every action and word as poor Blake is. Of course he can be manipulative. So is Vila (or had you forgotten the pretend-drunk scene so that he could get someone else to go into danger to fix the engine). Avon is, on the whole, lousy with people and hyper sensitive to other people trying to influence him. Of course *he'd* pick up on Blake's trying his best to get co-operation from him and label it with the most calculating thing he can think of. Dear boy. He's such an idiot. :-) Narrelle ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Tim Richards and Narrelle Harris parallax@wire.net.au http://www.wire.net.au/~parallax "Look, he's winding up the watch of his wit; by and by it will strike." - Shakespeare ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:08:37 -0000 From: "Jenni-Alison" To: "Space City" , "Lysator" Subject: [B7L] Altrincham Message-Id: <199802091207.NAA07874@samantha.lysator.liu.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello All Are there any Fans located anywhere nr Altrincham, nr Manchester? I will be spending a week on a training course from 23rd Feb, mouldering in a hotel, living on the lists 'till all hours to get my fix of B7, and hungering for the warmth of human companionship. I would love to meet with any fans who live around there for a drink. If you do live there, and would like to meet up, please email me Thanks Jenni Jenni-Alison@dial.pipex.com. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 00:00:14 +1100 From: Fran Myers To: B7 Subject: [B7L] Paul's acting Message-ID: <34DEFDDE.4AC3@ozemail.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Helen sez: > Paul's acting is very > subtle, and a person has to be good at reading faces in order to > understand him. To many people Avon is an enigma, but his eyes reveal > everything. I would have to disagree totally with this. Paul is about the least subtle actor on tv (well, Brit tv). He acts as though he was on stage, where actions have to be exaggerated, and facial expression enlarged. He's a real Ham. Fran M ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 08:21:55 -0500 (EST) From: NWOutsider To: "Blake's 7 list" Subject: Re: [B7L] Re: Blake's manipulativeness Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 9 Feb 1998, Tim Richards & Narrelle Harris wrote: > Julia said: > >That's the impression I get from several of the things Blake does - he's > >sincere, but he's also doing it for effect. Which I see as manipulation, > > As I see it, every human being everywhere in the world says things - both > truth and lies of varying intensity - for specific effect at some time or > another. It is human nature to present facts, opinions, points of view and > even mere anecdotes with some slant or other to either convince the > listener to do something(do the dishes, walk the dog) or believe something > (I am a cleverer person than everyone I work with). It's rarely done with > conscious, malicious effort (though some people are very good at it - > anyone in public life, for example). > > Thank heavens none of us are scrutinised as closely or regularly in our > every action and word as poor Blake is. > > Of course he can be manipulative. So is Vila (or had you forgotten the > pretend-drunk scene so that he could get someone else to go into danger to > fix the engine). > > Avon is, on the whole, lousy with people and hyper sensitive to other > people trying to influence him. Of course *he'd* pick up on Blake's trying > his best to get co-operation from him and label it with the most > calculating thing he can think of. > > Dear boy. He's such an idiot. :-) > > Narrelle This is so good and so on the money I wish I'd said it. Sue sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html B.I.T.C.H. "It's not just what I do, it's who I am." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:55:08 +0000 (GMT) From: Iain Coleman To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Paul's acting Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 10 Feb 1998, Fran Myers wrote: > Helen sez: > Paul's acting is very > > subtle, and a person has to be good at reading faces in order to > > understand him. To many people Avon is an enigma, but his eyes reveal > > everything. > > I would have to disagree totally with this. Paul is about the least > subtle actor on tv (well, Brit tv). He acts as though he was on stage, > where actions have to be exaggerated, and facial expression enlarged. > > He's a real Ham. You're both right! I sometimes find Paul's performances frustrating. Sometimes he shows nice subtle touches, then a few minutes later he's chewing the scenery. This latter behaviour seemed to get more pronounced as the series went on. He is often very good at bringing a lot out of the lines, in terms of playing the subtext rather than the text, and that's part of what makes Avon such an intriguing character. But in terms of acting skill, I would rate both Michael and Gareth higher (and Jackie, come to that - she even makes her scenes in "Animals" watchable). I was going to put forward a theory that Paul's lightest, most subtle acting happened when he had Gareth to play off - but then I remembered the closing scene of "Blake", which rather knackered that idea. Iain ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:15:32 +1100 From: "Roger The Shrubber" To: "B7 Main List" Subject: [B7L] role playing Message-Id: <199802091516.CAA09976@budapest.ozonline.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Fran wrote Michael is an ACTOR, and I can easily imagine him playing Avon. It would be a different Avon, of course, but I'm sure it would be just as convincing. ***** Take away the stoop, shoulders back, put some authority into the voice, different hair (spiky?), maybe add a lite beard, different clothes, and MK could easily play an Avon character. Soolin likewise could become Servalan with some tweaking ___________________________________ from Darren r ..... Comments are welcome ! powerplay@cheerful.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:27:35 -0500 (EST) From: NWOutsider To: "Blake's 7 list" Subject: Re: [B7L] Paul's acting Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 9 Feb 1998, Iain Coleman wrote: > I was going to put forward a theory that Paul's lightest, most subtle > acting happened when he had Gareth to play off - but then I remembered > the closing scene of "Blake", which rather knackered that idea. 8-) IMO, in the series, both Gareth and Paul do their best acting when the other has the spotlight. Blake listening to Avon and Grant, Avon supporting Blake in "Pressure Point," for example. Sue sclerc@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~sclerc/Blakes7.html B.I.T.C.H. "It's not just what I do, it's who I am." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:06:53 +0000 (GMT) From: Iain Coleman To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] role playing Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 10 Feb 1998, Roger The Shrubber wrote: > Fran wrote > Michael is an ACTOR, and I can easily imagine him playing Avon. It would > be a different Avon, of course, but I'm sure it would be just as > convincing. > ***** > Take away the stoop, shoulders back, put some authority into the voice, > different hair (spiky?), maybe add a lite beard, different clothes, and MK > could easily play an Avon character. I'm sure that if you gave MK the script for "Spacefall" and told him to play Avon as powerful, domineering and ruthless he would do so very well. What got me rambling about this was wondering what MK would do if given the lines and left to his own devices. It's impossible to say for sure, of course, but I imagined a much less dominant, more shadowy Avon - and I think that would have worked well, though it would probably end up with Tarrant being more in charge after Blake went AWOL. > > Soolin likewise could become Servalan with some tweaking Now this I just can't see. (brief pause while Iain tries to stop thinking about tweaking Soolin and Servalan) Right, now where was I? Ah yes, I really don't think Glynis Barber had anything like the power and presence of Jackie Pearce. Still, it's fun to imagine swapping actors around. Steven Pacey as Travis? A bit too young and good-looking, I suppose. Iain ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:58:09 -0000 From: "Heather Smith" To: "Blake's 7" Subject: Re: [B7L] role playing Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Roger wrote: > Take away the stoop, shoulders back, put some authority into the voice, > different hair (spiky?), maybe add a lite beard, different clothes, and MK > could easily play an Avon character. If you watch the Doctor Who story The Sunmakers (not to everybody's taste, but I like it) you can start to that Keating could play someone like Avon, in said story is again playing a rebel, but this time a meaner one (think dirty appearance, short scruffy beard), he's a v. good actor, his Sunmakers' character has no trace of the bumbling, lovable Vila. Heather 'can't think of a clever quote to go here' Smith 'There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish' -The fourth Doctor -------------------------------- End of blakes7-d Digest V98 Issue #39 *************************************